Monitoring For Color Correction

Hello Guru's out there.
I have a quick quection, I have a Mac Pro and wanted to purchase the ATI Radeon X1900 XT and use the extra DVI port as a Preview monitor output to An HDTV LCD 27" via DVI to HDMI. You know in final Cut's Video Playback option. Now would this be okay if my output is HDTV as final result? Will it work for Color correction or does DVI not send true color whatever, sampling? I thought that what you see is what you get if your sending a signal to the final output that it will be displayed at the end. Please Help me understand this madness.


Charles

Hey Charles!

You really can't accurately color correct on an LCD montor - so everyone says. Then several very costly LCD monitors are being sold as CC monitors.

Color Correction is another BIG area of disagreement as to WHAT that IS? Are you going to be CCing for television? Then you need color scopes!

It's really all about what the deliver product is. Where ever the final cut is going to, you need to know what the delivery limitations are. Any obvious color problems can be seen on a small TV set, but you are asking about DVI to an LCD for accurate color correction!

It will be interseting as to what others say about this question.

John

Problem is that there's no easy answer.

SD monitor is no good for HD colour correction - doesn't have the resolution or the right colours (709 v 601 etc.)

HD CRT monitors are no longer made. You can still get them, but when they're gone, they're gone. They're also expensive (other than that cheap 17" JVC) and very heavy. None of them display full HD resolution either.

Final issue for HD is what do people watch HD on? They don't watch it on a CRT but LCD or Plasma, or a projector. If you correct colour on a CRT, you're not seeing what the end user will see, and that has got to hurt the final viewable's quality.

And LCD's that are designed for colour correction like the ecinema or cinetal are very expensive. HD scopes are also very, very expensive.

And of course, what FCP outputs over the DVI is different to what goes out to HD tape, and looks different too......

Graeme

[www.nattress.com] - Plugins for FCP-X

It's clear the ATI Card is not the right option but is the black magic HD Studio not a good solution either? It has an HDMi out but then my problem is finding a HD TV that will handle all formats that is not too costly. 720p-1080P. You see the only final output that I will ever do is to HDTV's i.e. PLasma and HD LCD so I thought preview on a HDTV like a 27" - 32".

Hey Graeme

Why cant we use an LCD monitor to CC if final product will be viewed on a LCD monitor?

Michael Horton
-------------------

My facility (fairly well known Cable Sports Channel) is in the throes (thanx KM for the correction) of a giant HD conversion for the new year so I will have plenty to say in the upcoming months on this subject. Part of my job is Color Correcting everything that goes through my Department for Broadcast Air and it's still NTSC 601 / 720x486 through a 21" Sony CRT Professional SDI Monitor.

I would think (my opinion, now) that when my gear is upgraded to HD, my CC / Output Monitor will be of the 1080i/p LCD persuasion. The resolution & color reproduction is superior to Plasmas and extensive use "burn-in" isn't as prevelant with the LCD (from my own personal research). LCDs also have a longer lifespan than plasma screens - 60,000 hours typically...which means that if your monitor is operational for 8 hours a day / 5 days a week (40 hrs) / 52 weeks a year (2080 hrs), an LCD monitor will last upwards of 28.84615384615 years

Pick your monitor carefully... chances are you'll have it for quite a long time

More to come as we move into the HiDef age in 2007...

- Joey

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

It's been pure torture waiting for the SED monitors to come out. Exact glass kinescope characteristics in a large flat panel. Canon and Toshiba keep saying, "Maybe next year." We don't have a lot of years left, guys.

[www.behardware.com]

Anybody who has ever seen the Canon SED demo has been stunned by the difference just as anybody who has ever seen the flat panel technologies next to a glass kinescope conclude that it's a really good idea not very many people can do that. We would be writing checks on the spot, but the production SED monitor isn't ready yet.

Color range isn't the only thing you have to worry about. How many flicker problems made it out the door because the flat panel monitors couldn't show the errors to you? Anybody who has ever tried to color correct on a monitor with bad blacks and "funny" colors can tell you what fun that is.

SED monitors don't change at all with angle of view. No more hunching down in your chair to see what the picture looks like a little darker.


So, no. There is no good way yet. The Apple Cine Displays do well, and I saw a monitor as part of a demo that did pretty well. I cornered the engineer doing the demo and he confessed that the same raw imaging panel is behind both.

Good luck.

Koz

All great info guys but I wasn't thinking, Koz of using a computer LCD. Maybe something like the 32" Samsung or Westinghouse 32" 1080p HDTV and the Blackmagic HD studio NOW instead of the ATI Dvi card going to it as the output. Since this would be my final place of preview an HDTV should be suitable yes? Thanks joey, but what do the rest of you all think?


Charles

Charles,

Koz mentioned a very important point that I forgot to mention...a computer LCD won't show you interlacing issues (thank God for my CRT). I don't have any experience using an HDTV for an output monitor but a computer monitor will not.

- Joey

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

I was thinking about picking up a JVC HD monitor. Here in LA, you can get a 19" B-stock model for around $2 grand. Is that a waste of money Graeme? Or should I get my HD projector up and running? I need to replace a pricey bulb (around $500).

Kevin Monahan
Social Support Lead, DV Products
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The JVC monitor itself is 2 grand then you have to buy the Hd ad-on cards for another 2 grand is it worth it?


Charles

Projector Here I Come! ;-)

Kevin Monahan
Social Support Lead, DV Products
Adobe
Adobe After Effects
Adobe Premiere Pro
Adobe After Effects and Premiere Pro Community Blog
Follow Me on Twitter!

Color accuracy aside, would a small LCD TV at least make a decent studio monitor? Hook it up to the second DVI port to review DVCPro HD footage? Seems like it would be cheaper than installing a capture card or HD>SD converter, no?

Anything is better than nothing, but sometimes not by much.

The sweet spot for an NTSC television system is about 19". Bigger and it doesn't tell you any more and smaller you start to lose things. That same quality monitor for 1080 is four feet wide.

Yes, I am watching HiDef at home with a 19" glass monitor and it's cool even there, but I'm not Quality Controlling content, either. I can change resolutions of the monitor over wide ranges and the picture doesn't change which means I'm clearly not watching everything I should be.

There's still no good way out.

Koz