career advice needed

hi all. long time no post (so long that my account expired!).
my apologies if this is posted in the wrong forum. if it is, please tell me so and i will move it.

Basically I have a contract that will be done in the fall. I like my job -- shooting/ editing / motion graphics, / title design, and some directing -- but I feel a need to continue my expansion, monetarily as well as in my craft/artistry. We do 99% corporate video work and I need a bigger, more artful, challenge, like music videos or films, as that's always been more my focus. (I love the filmmaking process, been through a few films/tv from pre-prep to post)

I've been working in Toronto ever since I graduated, so I'm pondering how to make the next big step in my career.

I'm considering going to NYC, LA, or maybe Europe, if that is possible. From my limited knowledge, they seem to have the bigger canvases and budgets. My work is better when I get more responsibility, which I don't get from the corporates we do (I like bigger challenges).

I'm starting to gather a new reel and hope to spread it around before summer hits. My guess is feature films is the hardest to claw up to. My skills are diverse, but I think editing and title design is where I can contribute to the most (maybe film marketing, too).

I know this is the LA group, and making films is what I want to do ultimately, so I'd love to hear about what things are like there. I'm very open to going to other parts of the world as I know this will help me grow, so I'd love to hear about the ecology of other areas where our members work. NYC always seems like a big mecca...or maybe London?

Sorry, I know this is open ended. I'm at the beginning stages of embarking on this, so much remains unknown.

I hope this stimulates talk and communal sharing. I'm open to sharing any information about myself as well!

Thanks for reading.
Drew

Are you a US citizen? That plays a big role in considering a move to the US or anywhere, especially with our wacky and nutty immigration policy.

Michael Horton
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Asking this bunch for "Career advice" is like asking a Bartender where the local A.A. meetings are being held

I kid

Uh...not too open-ended

First off...this is not just an "LA Group" and we as a group have a wide array of experiences and talents (I personally can juggle a lemon, an egg and a baseball while rendering). The forum is based in LA but many of us are from all over the country & the world (many canadians as well). I live in Florida and I can honestly say that there are probably more Canadians here than in Canada.

I have to tell you... that's a pretty scary huge undertaking starting a new career in a new country without any actual offers or leads. A million things to consider:

1 - You should do a TON of research and nail down a gig before stepping out of your current gig. Sometimes companies will help you with your relocation.
2 - Mike is spot on... you would need citizenship or some kind of work visa I guess (I am not an authority on this - call US Immigration). One of our Designers is from Toronto and is still dealing with Immigration issues 2 years later.
3 - You should have a drop dead killer reel to carry around (also build a website to showcase your best work).

Features are not my forté (I am in Broadcast / Advertising). Breaking in to my arena means Interning (working for free or a very small stipend). Not recommended for someone that is starting fresh from another country. You would probably have to hold down another job to pay your bills.

There is too much to list here. You could always marry an LAFCPUG member and get a greencard

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

hi michael and grafixjoe (two names i know well).
thanks for the quick replies.

1. no im not a US citizen. i'd have to get a visa for sure. a few of my friends have design jobs in NYC and LA, so i can ask them about the details. two of them interned for the companies first, so maybe that made it easier to get a visa.

2. i definitely intend on lots of research before embarking on a new place. i've thought about moving without a secure offer (i'm young and still adventurous), but ideally i'm looking to get an offer before any move.

3. the website's coming for sure, as is the reel. my forte is more narrative driven pieces, but those gigs have been harder to come by, so my reel will be limited in that respect.
right now there should be about 7-10 pieces in my reel, ranging from corporates, PSA, tv spot, title design, and teaser trailer. my roles are usually creative direction, editing, and graphics. that's usually the number of pieces i aim for as a designer.....what do you all look for in reels?

is that enough, or should i build some pieces on my own as spec?
(i know quanlity beats quantity, i'll put the work online if you care to see it. i think joe has seen some of it from 2-3 years ago when i was graduating).

4. what are some resources for LA/NYC, etc, where i can start looking at what companies/types of companies i can start trying to talk to? i know tons of design resources, but not so much for editing or film/commercial/music video world related...

Interesting conversation!

Great that you brought that up, coz i was also thinking of moving, but probably in a year or so. Reel wise, as an editor, you'll definitely need to show off some mastery of the technique, both in editing and finishing, even if you're an offline editor. Why? Because it doesn't look credible for an editor to have a mucky looking encoding or questionable colors. Of course, there isn't a one size fits all approach- Johan Polhem has a nice showreel in Show and Tell which you can check out. But that montage in no way illustrates his ability to cut slow dialogue scenes or reality shows, but it's one hell good for commercials.

As long as your young with no responsibilities beyond yourself then do what your gut says and go for it. In other words don't get scared off by what you are supposed to do. Sometimes you just need to do it and then improvise. Research is great but no substitute for just doing it and keep doing what you need to do until you achieve your goals.

Don't play it safe. Not at this stage in your life. Plenty of time for that.

Michael Horton
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This is all good advice, but be smart about this move, there's still a writers strike going on and even if they resolved it tomorrow it will have an impact for several more months.

I have a saying: "in Hollywood never count on anything until your second paycheck."

If you have a friend who can get you to that second paycheck that would mitigate some of the risk, but if your coming to LA hoping to find a job, now might not be the best time.

Several of my friends have been asking me for work lately and they've been on network shows for more than 15 years. If they're starting to look around that might be an indicator that things are tightening up a bit.

Make sure you have friends who are willing to put you up. The last thing you want is to help America repopulate its slums.

Also, better if they are in the same industry- they could hook you up with jobs or pass on some jobs to you while you start finding stuff to do. Dubai is another interesting place if you're going to cast your net far and wide, and if you're up for some heat.

What is it you want to do? Full time editing, GFX, Directing? In all of Europe you will have difficulty getting a work permit no matter what you do and besides the money is crap unless you are a Smoke person or in there in the British TV trade. Budgets are becoming a joke for the hoops you have to jump through I would stay put in Toronto as lot of post is done there and wheeling and dealing. If you are more of a location shoot type go the Vancouver. I would love to work in LA, the city fascinates me to no end and I know people from the UK who have gone there and worked but without green cards. The balance of income vs creativity is a cross we all have to bear. Good luck Phil UK.

I agree with Phil - Toronto is supposed to be hot. My mentor Ralph Rosenblum told me, get to Toronto... of course that was a decade ago. I don;t know the scene there today, but.. you might just consider getting invited to some different parties, and have your disc handy.

- Loren
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thank you to everyone who's contributing, i really really appreciate it. sorry in advance for the large amount of writing...

1. Michael: I completely agree. I find that I'm better at what I do when I'm throw in the fire. I grew up having DV and computers, so I have lots of skills. I am a person who really loves to prep, though, so I'm not going to go out ill prepared.
I *am* worried about costs if I move out to LA/NYC without a job, though. As I understand it, Toronto is definitely cheaper.

2. chuck: second paycheque? please explain

3. strypes: interesting...what's going on in dubai?? i hate the heat, but if the work is interesting, who knows!

4. phil UK: *ideally* i want to direct. after shadowing 3 directors from prep to post, i know my skills and personality is suited for the orchestrating directors do. that said, the path to directing is completely unknown to me. when my friends try and help me figure out how to achieve it, it seems like the hardest, dumb-luck profession to break into. if you have any ideas, i'd love to hear them.
i do love the editing process, and i have formal education in graphics, so this is the direction i've chosen (so far) to approach directing/filmmaking. it seems companies keep stables of editors/graphics people, whereas directing looks to be all freelance all the time. it's hard to break into that when i don't have a reel...

5. loren: omg, ralph rosenblum! love his book. i picked it up this summer (after reading Christine Vachon's book) and found your memorial page. (love it).

questions:
1. how is the ecology around film editing and graphics? are there a few big companies doing most of the work, or are there lots of small boutique.
i know guys like Prologue and Yuco are out west, but they are mainly for marketing/graphics. are there some companies in your areas that you admire, that i should look into?

2. i'm sure some of you are in hiring positions. ideally, what do you want to see?

3. PhilUK: are you saying you have more creativity in the UK, but the income isn't so great? is this normal, or a new trend?
One reason i want to work in europe is definitely because the creativity allowed seems much more (at least from the outside).

4. How are you all feeling about the economic situation in the US, related to our field? Will budgets be affected much?

5. about directing: anybody have any ideas about how to pursue being a director?

About Toronto...
It's a great place to live, but budgets are small in comparison to the states (a big film here is $5mil) and pay doesn't get as big as the US, i think.
Title design wise, I know who does Cronenberg and Egoyan's titles, and neither do title design regularly. I know almost all the motion graphics places and it just doesn't seem to have as much potential to get bigger, as in the states. The projects aren't as interesting, either.

[5. loren: omg, ralph rosenblum! love his book. i picked it up this summer (after reading Christine Vachon's book) and found your memorial page. (love it). ]

Great-- thanks for visiting.

[ I know almost all the motion graphics places and it just doesn't seem to have as much potential to get bigger, as in the states. The projects aren't as interesting, either.]

Sounds like you're hitting a wall and expanding southward is a wise move. But network first.

To do LA right when comingin cold, I was given this advice--

1) Save 20 grand to live in reasonable comfort for a year.
2) Be prepared to work for free and be likeable.
3) Be prepared to work till dawn.

Hard workers usually don't escape notice. You decide when you've had enough of intern farms and bottomfeeding producers-- but again, network. It's a people business.

- Loren
Today's FCP keytip:
Instantly find Next/Previous timeline Gaps with Shift/Option -G !

Final Cut Studio 2 KeyGuide? Power Pack.
Now available at KeyGuide Central.
www.neotrondesign.com

Start making movies my friend even if you have to go cap in hand to all your friends and wash dishes to do so. You are in a good place for film, in Canada you have more grass roots support for movie making for it is written in the Canadian constitution the films will be made. Most deals for film in Canada are made in Toronto...go to it. Phil UK

> anybody have any ideas about how to pursue being a director?

To be a director you tend to have to make a few films/projects/music videos/spec commercials first, on your own, and most likely on your own dime. You'll need to have a very good reel. This is why film schools do have their value -- you meet a large number of people who want the same thing you do, and you trade favours (I edit your film, you produce mine), which are a terrific way of making friends who aren't just friends, but are war buddies.

I'd also suggest that if you're just going into directing, now is the time to take those narrative, technical and structural risks. Once you start making projects paid for by somebody else, those somebodies else will start telling you what to do. Also, a small, no-budget film can't compete with bigger ones for star power, production values and set pieces, so you'll be attracting people for different reasons. Traditionally low-budget features adore the comedy and horror genres, both genres in which money does not equate quality. Comedy's all about the script and performances and horror is all about shooting and atmosphere, and ironically, often the more money you pump into those two genres, the less effective and more conceited the end product becomes.


www.derekmok.com

I've been on several projects that sounded great but were shut down before I recieved my second paycheck.

My 2¢:

Apologize in advance...I just calls 'em likes I sees 'em.

You sound like you WANT to do many things...but do you have the chops? You are asking a lot of broad questions that don't have narrow answers. You want to Direct and want to know how to go about getting Director gigs? That sounds to me like you don't have the experience for that position or you would know that. Following around a Director around doesn't make you qualified (I followed Producers & Driectors around for YEARS... I learned a lot but that just made me a P.A.). Do you have any film school / practical (credits) experience under your belt? If you want honest feedback on a first step, post your reel with a breakdown in "Show & Tell" for critique.

You know, of course, you will need a K-I-L-L-E-R Demo reel, right?

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.