Some Titles Won't Render Others Do. Why? Anybody?

I have subtitles in place, created with FCP title maker. No problem.
I have some lower third IDs created in FCP title maker, no problem.
But then others have problems.some of the time line has redlines over titles and subtitles and lower-third ids, others don't.

As an experiment to solve the problems I've just created titles , laid them on the time line no problem. Add opacity and/or drop shadow, I get the red line.
Okay. But then when I hit render, the red line stays put.


I assume the problem is project settings.
Sequence with titles shows 1440x1080 25fps vid rate: apple prores 422 compressor.

FCP sequence settings 1440x1080 (16:9)
pixel aspect ration HD 1440 x 1080
field dominance Upper (odd)
editing timebase 25
quicktime video setings compressor HDV 1080/50
quality 100 %


2.5 GHz intel core 2 duo
4g 667 mhz ddr2 sdram
FCP 6.06
OSX 10.5.8
OWC elite 1 tb via FW800
G-technology 500 mb via FW400
two other firewire HDs via FW 400

Have you tried highlighting the clips and use
Render\Render Only\Needs Render???

Or group Clip Disable/Reenable, then try to render?


pricecom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have subtitles in place, created with FCP title
> maker. No problem.
> I have some lower third IDs created in FCP title
> maker, no problem.
> But then others have problems.some of the time
> line has redlines over titles and subtitles and
> lower-third ids, others don't.
>
> As an experiment to solve the problems I've just
> created titles , laid them on the time line no
> problem. Add opacity and/or drop shadow, I get the
> red line.
> Okay. But then when I hit render, the red line
> stays put.
>
>
> I assume the problem is project settings.
> Sequence with titles shows 1440x1080 25fps vid
> rate: apple prores 422 compressor.
>
> FCP sequence settings 1440x1080 (16:9)
> pixel aspect ration HD 1440 x 1080
> field dominance Upper (odd)
> editing timebase 25
> quicktime video setings compressor HDV 1080/50
> quality 100 %
>
>
> 2.5 GHz intel core 2 duo
> 4g 667 mhz ddr2 sdram
> FCP 6.06
> OSX 10.5.8
> OWC elite 1 tb via FW800
> G-technology 500 mb via FW400
> two other firewire HDs via FW 400

Try to to delete all render files via the Tools menu and then re-render.

Andreas

"I get the red line.
Okay. But then when I hit render, the red line stays put."

go to sequence menu > Render Selection,
check that the red render setting is ticked.

Thanks for the suggestions.
I checked, and the "red" render setting is ticked.

I am hesitant to dump all the render files, since some work.

I have a sequence in a project that is mostly all rendered. A few red lines out of 56 min. When I select all, and paste that timeline into a new sequence, I get mostly red lines, and neither render all nor render selection has any effect.

If I copy the good sequence, open a new project, a new sequence, and paste it in, I get red lines that won't render.

If I copy a small area, a shot with two titles above it with no red render bar, and past it into a "work" sequence, I get a red line that won't render.

One on-line editor suggested that perhaps the hard-drive is fragmented. That I should copy all the material onto a clean drive. Lot of work. Any other suggestions? As of now the Render function on this FCP 6 is on strike.

> I am hesitant to dump all the render files, since some work.

Render files are expendable by definition. They're also fragile, prone to corruption. If you're too hung up on them, you may not find the source of your problem.

> When I select all, and paste that timeline into a new sequence, I get mostly red lines, and
> neither render all nor render selection has any effect

Red lines can also denote audio needing rendering. Try Audio Mixdown (OPTION-APPLE-R).

If you suspect the hard drive, then change your Scratch Disk settings, then try again. Repairing Permissions can also solve some of these problems.


www.derekmok.com

how about this:
EXPORT your timeline the way it is now.
you'll have a copy with (some of) the effects you need.

then you can feel a bit safer about dumping your render files.


nick

A.) I have exported the timeline to a Quicktime self-contained .mov file. Eventhough the
renders were red the movie played flawlessly. I then went into Compressor and made
Mpg2 files and burned a DVD. All okay.

B.) I mixed down the audio, but the red lines still stayed in place.

C.) On the one timeline where most of the lines were green, I did a "render all" and the red lines
disappeared, although the process took over 30-minutes.

D.) On the timeline where most are red render lines the process says it will take 3 hours. I'll try
that over the weekend.

E.) Still, the simple "render selection" has no effect on either timeline.

F.) I've changed hard drives and scratch disks to no avail, but I'll try again.

G.) I've done the 'clip enable' 'clip disable' and the red line disappears over some of the clips, turns green, but on others stays red.

H.) If I eliminate the 'drop shadow' and 'opacity' from the title clips the line turns green. While red refuses to render.

Thanks for the help. Making progress, but it is slow.

And thanks to Shane, I hooked up the MBP to a Matrox MXO2 LE and a 27" Samsung HDTV. Seems okay, but wonder if the colors are true.

pricecom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A.) I have exported the timeline to a Quicktime
> self-contained .mov file. Eventhough the
> renders were red the movie played flawlessly. I
> then went into Compressor and made
> Mpg2 files and burned a DVD. All okay.
>
> B.) I mixed down the audio, but the red lines
> still stayed in place.
>
> C.) On the one timeline where most of the lines
> were green, I did a "render all" and the red
> lines
> disappeared, although the process took over
> 30-minutes.
>
> D.) On the timeline where most are red render
> lines the process says it will take 3 hours. I'll
> try
> that over the weekend.

Just in case you are "confused" about the "red lines" in the Timeline window, there are two sets of "render status bars." The top line is for video, the bottom is for audio. Sorry if you know this already. If not, you may want to check out the chapters on rendering in the FCP Manual.

Having no idea what your sequence looks like, it may be that the shorter quoted times are for audio, the longer for video.


>
> E.) Still, the simple "render selection" has no
> effect on either timeline.
>

Under the Render Selection menu item are several sub-items. Some of these sub-items may not be checked (active) and hence won't be applied when you do a "render selection" to "both," "video," or "audio."

This could explain why the bars don't go away.


> And thanks to Shane, I hooked up the MBP to a
> Matrox MXO2 LE and a 27" Samsung HDTV. Seems okay,
> but wonder if the colors are true.

You need to calibrate the HDTV. You then need to make sure you maintain the same ambient lighting conditions for the calibration to be valid while working with that HDTV. Of course, that HDTV probably has limitations on its quality/performance (some fraction of overall quality compared with a professional, color grading monitor).

Hope this info helps!


-Dave

also, trashing your FCP references is a good cure for general weirdness.

be warned that will re-set a lot of things, including the ticked items in the Render Sub-menus.

so backup our keyboard, button and window layouts,
and copy the contents of your favourites folder into a new project before you trash prefs.


nick

Thanks to all for responding.

I hit render all on two separate timelines, one in English, one in another language, and after a four-hour render the red lines disappeared.

I think followed DMacs comments, selected a section, and in 'render selection' checked everything. And then voila, the renders took. Red lines gone. Simple thing like that, it seems.

However, I get a 'ghost' clip now when I play that rendered section. A clip that does appear in the time line but not then, rather a few minutes farther back. This 'ghost' is an interview that runs for nearly a minute.
Perhaps I checked the wrong thing in the render list?

And the idea of the Matrox MXO2 LE and the cheap HDTV was to see a program monitor of what was on the timeline, not just a computer monitor. The technician at the store said the monitor was TN and I should rather get the Dell. These HD details are not my strong suit, and my budget for hardware didn't allow for a $5,000 Flanders or $20,000 whatever serious monitor. But a 'fraction' of the quality isn't a good standard, and may be misleading, if I understand Dave correctly.

I have seen FCP give problems in render when things are nested. Its not usual or often but i see that maybe 1.5% of the time. Opening the nest and rendering the nest does the trick for me.

you solved your problem but i thought that it might be something to hold on to in the future.

""" What you do with what you have, is more important than what you could do, with what you don't have."

> > > Knowledge + Action = Wisdom - J. Corbett 1992 """"

pricecom Wrote:

Quote

Thanks to all for responding.

I hit render all on two separate timelines, one in English, one in another language, and after a four-hour render the red lines disappeared.

I think followed DMacs comments, selected a section, and in 'render selection' checked everything. And then voila, the renders took. Red lines gone. Simple thing like that, it seems.

Those render sub-menu items (that are checked or unchecked) will determine whether things get rendered. It's one of those gotchas in FCP.


pricecom Wrote:

Quote

And the idea of the Matrox MXO2 LE and the cheap HDTV was to see a program monitor of what was on the timeline, not just a computer monitor. The technician at the store said the monitor was TN and I should rather get the Dell. These HD details are not my strong suit, and my budget for hardware didn't allow for a $5,000 Flanders or $20,000 whatever serious monitor. But a 'fraction' of the quality isn't a good standard, and may be misleading, if I understand Dave correctly.

As they would say in "Spartacus: Sand and Blood"... Apologies...
;-)

I probably didn't state things clearly enough. In an attempt not to further confuse things, I will try to restate my comments and add some detail.

In order to have a quality monitoring setup, from which to view an accurate representation of your timeline, you need a professional-level video I/O card or device and a "broadcast quality" monitor. Here's a rough generalization of different "levels" of external monitoring and the associated characteristics. Think of it as a producer or director view of external monitoring (i.e., for the more non-technical among us)...

-----

"Level 1"
At the high-end, you could use a Kona3 card, a BMD Decklink HD card, or even something like the Matrox MXO2 (maybe). To display things, you could pay $10K to $20K, or double that, on a highest-quality HD (or higher resolution) broadcast monitor. Monitors in this range are positioned as the highest performing for color grading, 2K and 4K film work, etc.

"Level 2"
For more modest budgets, you could use one of the mentioned I/O cards or devices and a sub-$5K monitor. Several companies sell "broadcast monitors" (20" to 27" typically) for under $5K, including Sony, JVC, Panasonic, Marshall, etc. Some computer oriented monitors, like the Dreamscape series from HP, can function quite well. Monitors in this range can provide full coverage of most color space specs, and can be used for color grading quite effectively.

"Level 3"
For even more modest budgets, you could use one of the I/O cards or devices mentioned, along with something like the Panasonic TH 42PF11UK 42" Plasma Display (thanks to Shane and others for mentioning these monitors). This monitor can be calibrated and provides full coverage of most/all color space specs. Using a setup like this can give you somewhere in the range of 90% (± xx%?) of the overall performance/quality of the higher-priced setups. So, this setup may be quite "good" for general editing and a good amount of color correction, especially for video destined for the Web, DVD, or even TV.

"Level 4"
At the bottom of the monitoring "food chain" would be the use of one of the I/O cards or devices, a standard def. deck via FireWire, or a FW-connected video camera, along with a standard def. monitor or a typical $500 consumer LCD/Plasma HDTV. With the standard def. monitor you would get a "downsized and downsampled" image that would work so-so for editing but not for color correcting HD video. Using a consumer HDTV would not give you reliable calibration nor a full color space to work with (HD video).

Note: This option is still preferable to anything you would see in the FCP Viewer or Canvas.

-----

So, my use of the term "fractional" was meant to indicate how close to a "Level 1" type of quality and performance you would get by using a lower "level" setup. It may be that using a setup that costs around $5K, or less, you can get "close enough"...

But, for certain, you will not get "close enough" only using the Canvas/Viewer in FCP, or what I describe as a "Level 4" setup.

I hope this helps, Larry? at least a little bit?


-Dave

Disclaimer:
I apologize for my choice of the various "levels" and omission of important details. I can appreciate those who may say that getting into more technical detail is necessary for a better understanding of the issues involved. Of course, my lack of concise explanation is my fault alone? If someone wants to add to what I've done already, and others think this info is of value, I would be willing to edit my post (or trash it) and write up an FAQ entry...