Still a bit confused about PAL Project

Ok, so I'm starting this PAL project (dailies are coming from India) and I will be receiving PAL DVCAMS. We are shooting super 16 and finishing with a DI. I will be providing a scan list for the telecine house back in India. Here's my question: I'm used to reverse telecine so that I can work in 24 fps. Can I do that with PAL? Or do I just stay in PAL land and give them an edl rather than a negative cut list for scan puposes?

Thanks again.

If they are shooting 25fps film then stay in PAL cutting 25 fps then at the end of the project you make it 24fps and the whole film is slowed by 4% and you will have to get the guys dubbing it to do a pitch shift on the music/vo/sync etc.

Makes sure they do the telecine logs ALE and/or FLEX files properly from the Telecines suite and on the DVCAM transfers ask them to burn in Tape Timecode extreme lower left and KeyKode extreme lower right so in the event of the telecine logs being wrong you will have a visual guide to cut/scan the original negative.

You will still give them a cut list even if they are scanning it.

If they are shooting 24 and they are transferring the Telecine at frame for frame 25fps then you do the same as above.

This is the usual and most common way of acheiving a 24fps master from 25fps source. I'm doing this at the moment on a feature I'm working on.

Remember that the total running time will need to be less to account for the 4% increase in length so if you're final film is 100minutes in 25fps then the 24fps version will be 104minutes.


Ben



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]

you CAN work at the true shooting speed of 24fps in FCP, if you want to,
and i see no reason not to,
especially if you have sync sound

read up on the 24@25 workflow in the Cinema Tools manual.
it's all pretty easy these days.
it;s not a reverse telecine, but a "Conforming" of the clips from one speed to another.
Basic workflow is shoot at 24, telecine at 25, capture at 25, "Conform" back to 24.
this is True 24fps, too, not the crazy NTSC 23.976!


apparently you can now (FCP6) work with subclips in a 24@25 workflow.
i still prefer a separate file for each clip,
but that may just be habit.

one small gotcha from the old days that might still be an issue:
it;s worth making a batch list of your captured clips immediately prior to "Conforming" them to 24fps.
then you'll have a reliable way to batch capture in the case of some unimaginable mis-fortune.
(i'm not really sure this is an issue anymore, but it wont hurt to be safe.)

its up to you and your post house whether you give them EDLs or Cut Lists.
both are possible.


cheers,
nick

Ok Nick, that sounds great. I did a little investigating in Cinema Tools and I get what you are saying. We have to sync dailies ourselves, so it sounds like I need to have the recordist recording at 24fps instead of 25, right, since the material imported into the project will be at 24?

Thanks again.

Hey Joe

If you are syncing Dallies yoursleves I guess you will have a clapper and sync to the clap?

If so then it doesn't matter what the recordist records.

As long as you do as Nick mentioned then the audio will match up.


However if they shot 24 and you don't convert to 24 and stay at 25 then you will need to adjust the audio to match.

One other thought - Check they aren't shooting 25fps!


Ben



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]

what Ben says:
they can shoot at any TC rate, it doesn't really matter.

but i guess if they shoot at 24fps, then you can make an EDL directly out of your FCP 24fps timeline, without going thru Cinema Tools.
im pretty vague on this, as i've usually handed over OMFs.
so dont take my work on it

whatever the sound post team are used to would be best, i suppose.



good luck with it,
nick

I'll post how things are going. Not starting for a couple of weeks...