Bad news in new updates!

After spending all of Sunday installing a fresh new system, hoping to fix my problems, I am now led to believe that there is a high probability the new Quicktime updates and/or FCS updates are causing major-major problems for some of us.

These problems include:

1) Stuttering during new captures, which is permanent in the file. Throws clip and file out of sync after stutters.

2) Progressively worse out-of-sync behavior for any clips previously captured before updates. But only in Final Cut Pro, not the QT Player window

A number of reports like these are just below on this forum but I dont think two and two have been put together yet by everybody. DVCPRO-HD, ProRes, DV, doesnt matter.

How about this: Is anyone with ALL of the latest updates NOT having problems???

Are only some reporting this because the FireWire universe may be immune? I'm on Kona doing analog HD capture. but thats not entirely relevant because of old clips getting the same disease.

MacPro Quad 2.66
FCP 6.0.3 (from latest ProApps update)
QT 7.4.5
Mac OS X 10.5.2
Kona Lh with 5.1 drivers

This has rendered my home HD edit system completely unusable. Fortunately I did not update the edit suite at work.

I think it might be time to send up the hurricane warning flag...

Perhaps a poll of users who have updated?

-Christopher S. Johnson

Any one else seeing anything like this?

Nope...no issues here on a MBP, Dual 2 Ghz G5 & Quad G5.

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

Might be too early to tell but lets hope a lot of people see this thread and then we know. Watch other forums too.

Michael Horton
-------------------

See this guy:

[www.lafcpug.org]

and this guy

[www.lafcpug.org]

Hmmmm. I wonder what the common denominator is.

And I would have to reinstall FCP and QT at this point to see if it is the case. Which seems alomost impossible to do without once again doing a complete fresh build of the OS, but not installing latest updates. Who knows how many deep places the OS has changed with the combo of new QT and ProApp.

-Christopher S. Johnson

Other reasons I want to blame the updates:

? I have an almost clone of this system at work, Kona Lh and everything, but without updates and it runs smooth as glass

? the problems started after installing the updates

? I did the most pure reinstall possible yesterday trying to fix the problem: erase drive, fresh OS, update OS and QT, fresh FCS 2, and then update of that, and finally the newest Kona software. This fresh install doesnt even have iLife or MS Office on it yet!

And now its useless. :-(

-Christopher S. Johnson

Real bad assumptions, but you may be right. One does sound similar to yours, the other does not.

Ha! The bad assumptions and deductive reasoning look pretty similar from here, Tom. Thats why I'm using words like "likely" and "I want to blame", rather than "I know for sure". But you are right, there is always another factor one hasnt thought of. For example, its been very hot here in LA.

Grafx Joe, what OS are you running on your Intel?

Anybody using a Kona card on a MacPro with these updates?

-Christopher

Oh and the first example *does* sound similar to mine. I noticed that his FCP 6 system includes these recent updates and this quote is exactly what is happening to me:

"Posted by: mediocrefilms
[badly out of sync issue] Yes, I am getting the problem in the viewer as well as the canvas/timeline. But when I reveal the problem clip in the finder I can open and play it in the Quicktime Player perfectly. "

-Christopher S. Johnson

Quote

Grafx Joe, what OS are you running on your Intel?

10.5.2

Quote

Anybody using a Kona card on a MacPro with these updates?

Yes...but not a MacPro... a Quad PPC / OS 10.4.11 - Kona LHe / Control Panel 5.1

In this business, a handful of similar situations doesn't dictate a pandemic. You get 20 people or more in a thread with the same issues in a short amount of time... then it's panic time.

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

The second doesn't report anything about stuttering.

I am now reformatting the entire drive and starting from scratch yet again. This time I will skip the latest updates and see what happens.

Thanks.

-Christopher

You might want to run the updates without the AJA.

The card?

Interesting.

Thanks, man.

-Christopher

I'm seeing a little stuttering in the video upon HDV capture, but my clips are fine (so far).

Mac Pro 2 x 3 GHz Dual-Core Intel Xeon
Latest QT and FCS update
Mac OSX 10.4.11

Stuttering on HDV capture preview is normal.

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

This has never happened to me before, though...not until I did the most recent software update.

Casey

Using a Quad Intel MacPro 3Ghz at work this last week with all the updates on Tiger NOT Leopard. No issues with SD or HD in uncompressed or in HDV/DVCproHD/ProRes.

Also using them on my Dual G5 and MacBook Pro with Leopard and no issues either.


Quick questions...

How much space (total/free) is on your system HDD(s) and media drives?

Have you run any maintenance software after the installations? At minimum run the Repair Disk Permissions then restart.

How much RAM do you have?


Also which version of the 5.1 driver are you using?

Quote
Excerpt from the AJA website
KONA LH/LHe Drivers Version 5.1 NDD, Control Panel, and Notes
(Release Date 2/14/2008, TAR archive)
This 5.1 NDD version is recommended for OS X 10.5.2 users. Note: The AJA
KONA driver version 5.1 NDD is the same as driver version 5.1, but removes
the Macintosh Desktop Display feature.

With the regular version of the 5.1 driver, some users may experience issues with Quartz Extreme, the behavior of their computer displays, and in some cases, kernel panics may occur with certain graphics cards installed. If any of the issues mentioned occur, the driver version 5.1 NDD should be used instead of version 5.1. Driver version 5.1 NDD is also the recommended version for use with the latest Intel Xserve with Xeon 5400 series processors, model (MA882LL/A).

I'd try the NDD version or visa versa and see if that helps.



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]

Thanks Ben. Yes I did those specific things before the first major re-install. Thanks for checking, though.

Last night I reinstalled the OS to 10.5.2 and QuickTime up to 7.4.1. Tonight I'm doing the ProApps all the way up to BEFORE the most recent update, leaving FCP at 6.0.2.

We'll see what happens and I'll report very late this evening.

Thanks again.

-Christopher

I too would be interested to see what happens without the AJA card. I have heard of several recent problems with audio sync issues tied to the Kona drivers. One solved by correcting the mismatch OS version and Kona driver. The other is in HD at 720p and remains a mystery.

...and I am using QT 7.4.5. not 7.4.1.

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

On the bright side, I can now hear audio while capturing from my Z1U

Here's a connection...the video only glitches at the beginning of the clip while the audio is kicking in on the capture.

Chris

Quote

Yes I did those specific things before the first major re-install

You actually need to do it after the install of everything then restart the Mac.

The other issue that some people found is with old QT receipts causing issues... I don't have a link to hand but a google/LAFCPUG search might come up trumps.


Casey

Quote

Here's a connection...the video only glitches at the beginning of the clip while the audio is kicking in on the capture.

What settings are you using? Can you post the entire capture setup including hardware/software and settings please.




The thing I often see on AJA stuff is inconsistent audio delay between the Canvas/View and the Monitor out. Sometime (but rarely) its in-sync with other monitor sources and other times its waaaay out.

Are you guys monitoring the audio from the Kona and viewing the footage in the viewer and not an external monitor?

FCP Video and Audio should always be monitored together through the same output so for DV via FireWire you monitor DV video and Audio via Firewire not video in canvas and audio on DV Audio...

So if you are listening to the audio through the Kona you view the video through the kona out as well or you will almost definitely encounter what looks like sync problems - especially if your QTs play correctly in QT Player...

Forgive me if I am teaching your Granny to suck eggs; but we have to check as neither of you have posted all your settings or workflow. Jot them down or take some screen shots to give us a better picture.



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]

Hi Ben, thanks for your thoroughness. I investigated all of those factors both before and after my fresh system install.

My two drive RAID had 600 Gigs left and runs around 100MB/sec.

I monitor on external production speakers and a calibrated HDTV. The kind of "out of sync" Im talking about is variable and starts wherever the playhead is set and gets PROGRESSIVELY worse upon stuttering. For example, if I let a clip, any clip from the past TEN YEARS of capturing, run freely in Final Cut Pro, it can get up to two MINUTES out of sync. And they play perfectly in QT Player.

And NEW captures are "for real" messed up, both in FCP and QT player. The actual file is bad on NEW captures.

And all of this happened after installing the new QT and ProApp updates. And it happened again after a fresh install of everything.

Now, about my second fresh install without the latest updates: I'm installing FCS 2 now and will update this post later.

This could be an AJA problem. So far, nobody here at LAFCPUG has reported having a recent Intel MacPro/AJA system with the latest updates. This COULD be the bad combo.

-Christopher

> the video only glitches at the beginning of the clip while the audio is kicking in on the capture.

There may be a much simpler explanation to this. As early as 2001 I noticed that certain tapes (related to cameras?) had a "burst" in the beginning of the tape that would put the rest of the capture completely out of sync. Skip that part of the capture and all is fine. So I'm thinking your issue may not be related to the updates, but to specific tapes.

Did you test the system with tapes you've already captured before successfully?


www.derekmok.com

Fresh FCS install going very late. Damn LiveType media.

I'm just using the HDV preset, capturing from my Z1 thru firewire doing the "capture now". I don't have any additional video cards, and am using the Mac Pro 2 x 3 GHz Dual-Core Intel Xeon with the latest QT and FCS update and running Mac OSX 10.4.11.

Everything seems to be working like it did before the update...just that now I can hear audio while I am capturing (just from the headphone jack on the Mac Pro), and there's that little hitch on the capture screen before the audio kicks in. The hitch is only on the capture window, the actual clip is fine...it just happens when I hit play on my deck and then hit capture now, then I might see two or three hitches in the video then the audio comes up and everything is fine after that.

If there's anything else hardware/software-wise you need to know, just ask me specifically...I'm not sure if there's a way to just send you a "log" of my hardware/software settings.

Thanks!!
Casey

FCS 2 installed and the early updates (not the new ones) are downloading this morning. I have to go pay the bills on the office edit system toady and will return to this matter in the evening.

Thanks guys.

By the way: I did have the Kona card installed during the OS install, and then after reading a recommendation here, I removed it before installing the Pro Apps.

-Christopher

Let us know how it goes Chris - have you contacted anyone at AJA directly?



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]