Crashes

I have no idea how to pose this question. Final Cut has never been that stable on my machine but for a while I seem to get it working reasonably well, largely by avoiding mixing different codecs on the time line, nesting, and round tripping with anything. But since Snow Leopard came on board, FCP just crashes while doing no more than moving a clip with no filters on a time line with no more than two or three clips on it. It doesn't crash every time, just randomly and frequently.

So what are the usual causes of this? My Mac Pro is a pretty new machine and I've had it checked out by Apple Engineers who could give me no answers.



Model Name: Mac Pro
Model Identifier: MacPro3,1
Processor Name: Quad-Core Intel Xeon
Processor Speed: 2.8 GHz
Number Of Processors: 2
Total Number Of Cores: 8
L2 Cache (per processor): 12 MB
Memory: 8 GB

Chipset Model: NVIDIA Quadro FX 5600
Type: GPU
Bus: PCIe
Slot: Slot-1
PCIe Lane Width: x16
VRAM (Total): 1536 MB
Vendor: NVIDIA (0x10de)
Device ID: 0x019d
Revision ID: 0x00a2
ROM Revision: 3221
Displays:
Cinema HD:
Resolution: 2560 x 1600
Pixel Depth: 32-Bit Color (ARGB8888)
Main Display: Yes
Mirror: Off
Online: Yes
Rotation: Supported
SyncMaster:
Resolution: 1920 x 1080 @ 60 Hz
Pixel Depth: 32-Bit Color (ARGB8888)
Mirror: Off
Online: Yes
Rotation: Supported

I don't know whether this is of any use. It's just the first few lines of a very long event log of the last crash...

May 27 17:55:23 lawrence-grays-mac-pro [0x0-0x1d01d].com.apple.FinalCutPro[254]: *** error: can't allocate region
May 27 17:55:23 lawrence-grays-mac-pro [0x0-0x1d01d].com.apple.FinalCutPro[254]: *** set a breakpoint in malloc_error_break to debug
May 27 17:55:23 lawrence-grays-mac-pro [0x0-0x1d01d].com.apple.FinalCutPro[254]: Final Cut Pro(254,0xde34e0) malloc: *** mmap(size=268439552) failed (error code=12)
May 27 17:55:23 lawrence-grays-mac-pro Final Cut Pro[254]: Final Cut Pro(254,0xde34e0) malloc: *** mmap(size=268439552) failed (error code=12)\n*** error: can't allocate region\n*** set a breakpoint in malloc_error_break to debug
May 27 17:55:23 lawrence-grays-mac-pro [0x0-0x1d01d].com.apple.FinalCutPro[254]: *** error: can't allocate region

Without more info, it seems like this is a memory issue (RAM). You may also have a bad FCP installation. Make sure your start-up drive isn't too full (or any of your media drives --- though this doesn't seem like it's the problem).

You may want to check out this wonderful set of tools: FCS Maintenance Pack.

If your problem is bad RAM, which seems very likely, you can do a few things: test the RAM yourself; swap modules or remove pairs of modules to isolate bad or mis-seated ones; or replace all RAM.

Here's a nice tool for doing rigorous memory (RAM) testing: Rember. It is a GUI front-end for the memtest tool, which is command-line only. To use Rember, start up your Mac Pro while holding the shift key, then run Rember without any other applications running (could take several hours, or overnight). Even better, if you're comfortable with using Terminal, would be to run memtest.


-Dave

Thanks.

It's hard to know what information to supply as the problem seems very generalised.

I've reinstalled FCP many times. Had engineers in who tested everything and also did a reinstall.

I'll try the remtest again. Though I think it probably won't do any harm to get more RAM and swap what I have and see if that works. If I end up with extra RAM that probably won't be a bad idea anyway.

Other suspects are the Nvidia display card which seems not to be well supported by Mac despite it being bundled with them. And maybe the Blackmagic capture card I have. I'm reluctant to buy new cards because they're so expensive and if they aren't the problem then it's a waste.

Certainly when I use filters such as CoreMelts or Veescope I can guarantee crashes. Snowleopard doesn't seem to like them too much.

But even when I'm not using them and doing little more than shifting a clip on the time line, or even moving a clip from one bin to another, I can get a crash. I assume that flags a memory problem but i have had the memory tested and that sort of crash didn't happen until after installing Snowleopard.

Before Snowleopard my machine would not populate menus very well - 7 seconds to open a file. As soon as I got snowleopard that problem stopped, so I gained in performance with that. But then these other problems started.

But I've never had a day without FCP crashing so it might not be Snowleopard's fault. But rather that merely uses more of some faulty hardware.

Lawrence,

You shouldn't be having any stability or crash problems with that Mac Pro and FCP, on either Leopard or Snow Leopard.

I saw your post on the Apple Discussions forum.

I'd suggest removing your video I/O card, leaving just the display card in your Mac Pro. Then, do the things you know have been causing crashes. If things still crash, your display card may be faulty. There are sporadic reports about your display card not working well with Apple's pro apps and some Adobe apps. It could be the ROM version in your card, or a bad card.

You should report the crashes to the Veescope and CoreMelt developers. They may have some insights into your issue.

If removing the I/O card solves the issue, report it to the manufacturer.

If, after removing all third-party HW (video I/O card), problems persist and you have AppleCare, I would try to get the entire thing swapped out. If you can document the problems, Apple or the reseller should take care of you. That nVidia card and the Mac Pro are too expensive to not work properly.

What a pain in the ass... I hope you get this sorted out...


-Dave

P.S. - Check out this article on BareFeats.com. It shows how poorly your display card does in comparison to many other cards, especially when price is considered. The ATI Radeon 4870, which may soon be replaced, might be a good choice if you need to have your display card replaced by Apple, or by you.

Can you post one (or more) of the crash logs here? It's impossible to say what it could be without seeing them.

How did you install Snow Leopard originally? If you just installed it over the top of an existing Leopard installation with Final Cut Studio, this is a bad way to do it. Also, it's best to remove Final Cut Studio and reinstall it rather than simply reinstall over the top.

My software:
Pro Maintenance Tools - Tools to keep Final Cut Studio, Final Cut Pro X, Avid Media Composer and Adobe Premiere Pro running smoothly and fix problems when they arise
Pro Media Tools - Edit QuickTime chapters and metadata, detect gamma shifts, edit markers, watch renders and more
More tools...

Here's one that just happened while trying to render a time line. This one had the veescope plug in on it. It failed to render previously. But i didn't save that crash. I tried to render again but cancelled the render to check it was being sent to where I wanted it to go and I got a crash.



Process: Final Cut Pro [728]
Path: /Applications/Final Cut Pro.app/Contents/MacOS/Final Cut Pro
Identifier: com.apple.FinalCutPro
Version: 7.0.2 (7.0.2)
Build Info: FCPApp-955601010~8
Code Type: X86 (Native)
Parent Process: launchd [94]

Date/Time: 2010-05-29 00:35:01.478 +0800
OS Version: Mac OS X 10.6.3 (10D573)
Report Version: 6

Interval Since Last Report: 90954 sec
Crashes Since Last Report: 11
Per-App Interval Since Last Report: 58460 sec
Per-App Crashes Since Last Report: 10
Anonymous UUID: 7AAB885D-F6C4-4F14-B746-0B6285DCD9E6

Exception Type: EXC_CRASH (SIGABRT)
Exception Codes: 0x0000000000000000, 0x0000000000000000
Crashed Thread: 0 Dispatch queue: com.apple.main-thread

Application Specific Information:
abort() called

Thread 48:
0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x00c2c342 semaphore_wait_signal_trap + 10
1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x00c59eb8 _pthread_cond_wait + 1089
2 libSystem.B.dylib 0x00ca242f pthread_cond_wait + 48
3 com.apple.AppleHDVCodec 0x198f326c MPEG2CompressorComponentDispatch + 199756
4 ??? 0x00000002 0 + 2

Thread 49:
0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x00c51bd2 __workq_kernreturn + 10
1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x00c52168 _pthread_wqthread + 941
2 libSystem.B.dylib 0x00c51d86 start_wqthread + 30

Thread 50:
0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x00c5a262 __semwait_signal + 10
1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x00c85e44 nanosleep$UNIX2003 + 188
2 libSystem.B.dylib 0x00c85d82 usleep$UNIX2003 + 61
3 com.apple.DesktopVideoOut 0x1fc05903 DVOClockGetTime + 984
4 libSystem.B.dylib 0x00c59a19 _pthread_start + 345
5 libSystem.B.dylib 0x00c5989e thread_start + 34

Thread 0 crashed with X86 Thread State (32-bit):
eax: 0x00000000 ebx: 0x00d3594b ecx: 0xbfff60cc edx: 0x00c8d132
edi: 0x00000000 esi: 0x00dd7b10 ebp: 0xbfff60e8 esp: 0xbfff60cc
ss: 0x0000001f efl: 0x00000282 eip: 0x00c8d132 cs: 0x00000007
ds: 0x0000001f es: 0x0000001f fs: 0x00000000 gs: 0x00000037
cr2: 0x00d1f8cb

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0x5e92d000 - 0x5ea6fff7 com.apple.syncservices 5.2 (578.3) <16A29689-1A80-3065-C4E7-AEC6A3C05C2E> /System/Library/Frameworks/SyncServices.framework/Versions/A/SyncServices
0x5eae6000 - 0x5eb5afef com.apple.CoreSymbolication 2.0 (23) <8A04EA5F-83F8-5E15-B2E0-8A727C9C4E8B> /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/CoreSymbolication.framework/Versions/A/CoreSymbolication
0x64710000 - 0x647c0fe3 com.apple.QuickTimeImporters.component 7.6.6 (1729) <6C2372BA-69D9-E713-902F-95E16FD18EFD> /System/Library/QuickTime/QuickTimeImporters.component/Contents/MacOS/QuickTimeImporters
0x64ad6000 - 0x64ad8ff7 libclparser.dylib ??? (???) <0585F11B-F4FD-05DC-C7CE-556B0539E003> /System/Library/Frameworks/OpenCL.framework/Libraries/libclparser.dylib
0x64add000 - 0x64ae1ff7 libcldcpuengine.dylib 1.3.38 (compatibility 1.0.0) <60B4CED7-D47B-4CB4-B044-49493340302F> /System/Library/Frameworks/OpenCL.framework/Libraries/libcldcpuengine.dylib
0x64af8000 - 0x64afaffd +net.kineme.StructureTools 0.1 (20080606) <91F0A736-0AB0-A444-EED9-E5792A36783B> /Library/Graphics/Quartz Composer Patches/StructureTools.plugin/Contents/MacOS/StructureTools
0x64b00000 - 0x64b07ff3 com.apple.print.framework.Print 6.1 (237.1) <97AB70B6-C653-212F-CFD3-E3816D0F5C22> /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/Print.framework/Versions/A/Print
0x70000000 - 0x700caffb com.apple.audio.units.Components 1.6.1 (1.6.1) <AEC44B68-A209-4093-36B0-7B740361249B> /System/Library/Components/CoreAudio.component/Contents/MacOS/CoreAudio
0x787a3000 - 0x787cdff7 com.apple.shortcut 1.1 (1.1) <B0514FA9-7CAE-AD94-93CA-7B2A2C5F7B8A> /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/Shortcut.framework/Versions/A/Shortcut
0x787e6000 - 0x787f0ff7 com.apple.HelpData 2.0.4 (34) <9128FFEB-0F6C-B273-FCF4-D87A20227345> /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/HelpData.framework/Versions/A/HelpData
0x79ba8000 - 0x79bbcfff +com.noiseindustries.Units ??? (1.1.6) <7FA44DC6-A6E8-A5D1-4844-9DD30698C8DA> /Library/Graphics/Image Units/Noise Industries Units.plugin/Contents/MacOS/Noise Industries Units
0x79df9000 - 0x79e04fef com.apple.myImageUnit 1.0 (1.0) <B6E61D4E-A7D4-41C0-8CD9-1F6A9EF3DD90> /Library/Graphics/Image Units/SoftlyghtImageUnit.plugin/Contents/MacOS/SoftlyghtImageUnit
0x79e15000 - 0x79e39ff7 com.apple.QuartzComposer.ExtraPatches 3.1 (156.13) <5D026B4A-3718-7D93-F4BD-3D86043DA8E6> /System/Library/Frameworks/Quartz.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/QuartzComposer.framework/Versions/A/Resources/ExtraPatches.plugin/Contents/MacOS/ExtraPatches
0x79e49000 - 0x79f5fff7 com.apple.PubSub 1.0.4 (65.12.1) <1B79C698-A2A1-6B74-A137-67516ABE088E> /System/Library/Frameworks/PubSub.framework/Versions/A/PubSub
0x79fc4000 - 0x79fecfeb com.apple.audio.OpenAL 1.3 (1.3) <17F53393-0AA6-5FC6-6544-7EFAFB7F13AD> /System/Library/Frameworks/OpenAL.framework/Versions/A/OpenAL
0x79ffa000 - 0x7a000ff7 +net.kineme.AudioTools 0.8 (20090713) <28616160-C9EC-E46A-3FF8-D5E173296F50> /Library/Graphics/Quartz Composer Patches/AudioTools.plugin/Contents/MacOS/AudioTools
0x7a007000 - 0x7a00dff7 +net.kineme.FileTools 0.5 (20100318.0416r7203) <AA0F7EEA-5377-6519-EFDC-1F5104F01CAA> /Library/Graphics/Quartz Composer Patches/FileTools.plugin/Contents/MacOS/FileTools
0x7a017000 - 0x7a039ff7 +net.kineme.GLTools_NoAlphaBlend 1.6 (20100310.1619r7174) <ADBA5E9E-DBBA-B3B2-D60E-3BAFC75C49D1> /Library/Graphics/Quartz Composer Patches/GLTools_NoAlphaBlend.plugin/Contents/MacOS/GLTools
0x7a059000 - 0x7a05bff7 com.apple.podcastproducer.ImageDiffer 1.2.1 (168) <1EC547D8-6086-0C78-5959-4968D58A6E58> /System/Library/Graphics/Quartz Composer Patches/ImageDifferPatch.plugin/Contents/MacOS/ImageDifferPatch
0x84339000 - 0x843b3fe3 com.apple.AppleVAH264HW.component 2.0 (1.0) <0FC65A8D-3E68-BC03-284B-EFACF6915686> /System/Library/QuickTime/AppleVAH264HW.component/Contents/MacOS/AppleVAH264HW
0x84476000 - 0x8451dffb com.apple.GeForceVADriver 1.6.10 (6.1.0) <2D845B2C-51D9-4044-11A9-B2701691F8F8> /System/Library/Extensions/GeForceVADriver.bundle/Contents/MacOS/GeForceVADriver
0x85892000 - 0x8590ffe7 com.apple.AppleVADriver 4.8.11 (4.8.11) <2CA2C6E4-70DF-3FC4-688E-59FC03A7BF84> /System/Library/Extensions/AppleVADriver.bundle/Contents/MacOS/AppleVADriver
0x8f12c000 - 0x8f7b4fff com.apple.GeForceGLDriver 1.6.10 (6.1.0) <EFC80A22-4F62-3DFC-A391-738B2A8A4E56> /System/Library/Extensions/GeForceGLDriver.bundle/Contents/MacOS/GeForceGLDriver
0x8fe00000 - 0x8fe4162b dyld 132.1 (???) <211AF0DD-42D9-79C8-BB6A-1F4BEEF4B4AB> /usr/lib/dyld
0xf0000000 - 0xf018cfe6 +com.mainconcept.mch264enc 8.0 (8.0.0.44755) /Library/Application Support/ProApps/SharedA/Frameworks/H264Encoder.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/mch264enc.framework/mch264enc
0xfa100000 - 0xfa192fe3 com.apple.print.framework.PrintCore 6.2 (312.5) <7729B4D7-D661-D669-FA7E-510F93F685A6> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/PrintCore.framework/Versions/A/PrintCore
0xffff0000 - 0xffff1fff libSystem.B.dylib ??? (???) <06A5336A-A6F6-4E62-F55F-4909A64631C2> /usr/lib/libSystem.B.dylib

Model: MacPro3,1, BootROM MP31.006C.B05, 8 processors, Quad-Core Intel Xeon, 2.8 GHz, 8 GB, SMC 1.25f4
Graphics: NVIDIA Quadro FX 5600, NVIDIA Quadro FX 5600, PCIe, 1536 MB
Memory Module: global_name
AirPort: spairport_wireless_card_type_airport_extreme (0x14E4, 0x88), Broadcom BCM43xx 1.0 (5.10.91.27)
Bluetooth: Version 2.3.1f4, 2 service, 19 devices, 1 incoming serial ports
Network Service: AirPort, AirPort, en2
PCI Card: Apple RAID Card, sppci_raid, Slot-4
PCI Card: NVIDIA Quadro FX 5600, Display, Slot-1
PCI Card: pcibdbd,a11a, sppci_video, Slot-2
Parallel ATA Device: OPTIARC DVD RW AD-7170A
USB Device: Hub, 0x05ac (Apple Inc.), 0x912f, 0xfd300000
USB Device: Hub, 0x0424 (SMSC), 0x2503, 0xfd330000
USB Device: KEYBOARD, 0x4320, 0x0302, 0xfd333000
USB Device: My Book, 0x1058 (Western Digital Technologies, Inc.), 0x1100, 0xfd331000
USB Device: Apple Cinema HD Display, 0x05ac (Apple Inc.), 0x9221, 0xfd320000
USB Device: USB Receiver, 0x046d (Logitech Inc.), 0xc52b, 0x1d100000
USB Device: Bluetooth USB Host Controller, 0x05ac (Apple Inc.), 0x8206, 0x5d200000
FireWire Device: built-in_hub, Up to 800 Mb/sec
FireWire Device: 4big Quadra, LaCie, Up to 800 Mb/sec
FireWire Device: unknown_device, Unknown

I don't know if this is any use but it's what I get all the time in my system log...


May 29 00:41:47 lawrence-grays-mac-pro Final Cut Pro[822]: Final Cut Pro(822,0xde34e0) malloc: *** mmap(size=268439552) failed (error code=12)\n*** error: can't allocate region\n*** set a breakpoint in malloc_error_break to debug
May 29 00:41:47 lawrence-grays-mac-pro [0x0-0x9c09c].com.apple.FinalCutPro[822]: Final Cut Pro(822,0xde34e0) malloc: *** mmap(size=268439552) failed (error code=12)
May 29 00:41:47 lawrence-grays-mac-pro [0x0-0x9c09c].com.apple.FinalCutPro[822]: *** error: can't allocate region
May 29 00:41:47 lawrence-grays-mac-pro [0x0-0x9c09c].com.apple.FinalCutPro[822]: *** set a breakpoint in malloc_error_break to debug
May 29 00:41:47 lawrence-grays-mac-pro Final Cut Pro[822]: Final Cut Pro(822,0xde34e0) malloc: *** mmap(size=268439552) failed (error code=12)\n*** error: can't allocate region\n*** set a breakpoint in malloc_error_break to debug
May 29 00:41:47 lawrence-grays-mac-pro [0x0-0x9c09c].com.apple.FinalCutPro[822]: Final Cut Pro(822,0xde34e0) malloc: *** mmap(size=268439552) failed (error code=12)
May 29 00:41:47 lawrence-grays-mac-pro [0x0-0x9c09c].com.apple.FinalCutPro[822]: *** error: can't allocate region
May 29 00:41:47 lawrence-grays-mac-pro [0x0-0x9c09c].com.apple.FinalCutPro[822]: *** set a breakpoint in malloc_error_break to debug
May 29 00:41:47 lawrence-grays-mac-pro Final Cut Pro[822]: Final Cut Pro(822,0xde34e0) malloc: *** mmap(size=268439552) failed (error code=12)\n*** error: can't allocate region\n*** set a breakpoint in malloc_error_break to debug

Lawrence,

PLEASE do not post entire debug / system logs here. You would be better served contacting Apple about this and posting in the appropriate Discussion Forum:

[discussions.apple.com]

Thank you

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

Well Jon Chappell asked him to post crash logs so in this case it is warranted. Might be a line in there that points to the problem.

Michael Horton
-------------------

You da boss.

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

...but getting these logs to someone who knows what to look for instead of us guessing would save time...and forum real estate

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

It looks to me like you have a very complex project. What is the file size of your project file? It also looks like you have a lot of HDV clips that you're putting effects onto. This can bring Final Cut Pro quite easily to its knees.

If the issue is what I suspect it to be, you can get rid of the crashes by reducing the complexity of your project (perhaps by creating a "lite" version with just the sequences you need) and converting the HDV stuff to ProRes.

P.S. I didn't gather any of this information from the crashed thread so that's why I needed the entire crash log.

My software:
Pro Maintenance Tools - Tools to keep Final Cut Studio, Final Cut Pro X, Avid Media Composer and Adobe Premiere Pro running smoothly and fix problems when they arise
Pro Media Tools - Edit QuickTime chapters and metadata, detect gamma shifts, edit markers, watch renders and more
More tools...

Don't know about it being very complex. Three minutes with a the green screen keyed out and a mask. I import XD CAM EX files.

At the moment I'm trying to render it out to pro res but it keeps crashing!

I'm also getting "Out of Memory" notices. I take it that means I need to go and clean out the Render Manager?

Yep, this is the cause of the problem. It's best not to perform heavy effects on long-GOP footage such as XDCAM, H.264, MPEG-2, HDV, etc.

I would advise taking the original footage, converting it to ProRes in Compressor and then reapplying the green screen effect to it.

My software:
Pro Maintenance Tools - Tools to keep Final Cut Studio, Final Cut Pro X, Avid Media Composer and Adobe Premiere Pro running smoothly and fix problems when they arise
Pro Media Tools - Edit QuickTime chapters and metadata, detect gamma shifts, edit markers, watch renders and more
More tools...

That seems to be a factor in this crash. I'll delete the filters and render it out to pro res. Another little problem that never quite gets in the instruction manuals! (A bit like the rule never to round trip in Motion!)

I've also cleaned out the Render Manager which might be another contributing problem.

I still have problems with the machine that are unaccounted for... I've an SD project which should cause no problems as it's simply a holiday video with no pretensions to anything. And was getting crashes on that!

It could be an intermittent hardware issue but I have had the Apple engineers check everything. So somewhere there could some driver that's causing the problem. Some update. Some plug in.

Anyway thanks for the help.

Hi all, (>corny moment) long time reader, first time poster...so anyway, we're having the same issues here, I'm Snr SysAdmin at a post house in London and we're seeing exactly this issue across a single project (very large >20TB P2 transcoded (via Compressor) >ProRes (HQ)). We have 3 of our suites put aside for 9 months of editing for this client, and its been nothing but disastrous event after another. Mostly FCP hanging, not crashing but kicking into a spin and failing to return from that spin, even if left for a number of hours. We have tried every possible fix on this:
- Replaced MacPros - started out with 2007 models and have moved up to early 2010 models now
- Replaced RAM
- Upgraded RAM upto 16GB
- Reordered file structure (over 17,000 media files involved from various sources), so there are only 50 items per folder
- Ran checksum of every piece of media to confirm validity of files
- Ran Corrupt File Finder across all projects, with 0 errors returned
- Cleansed all file names, removing any and all illegal characters
- Created new project files, with new sequences and moved copy/pasted into new timeline
- Exported as XML, and re-imported
- Ran all system and FCP updates (currently on 10.6.4, FCP 7.0.3, ProKit 6.0.1)
- Removed AJA KONA LHi cards
- Removed AJA software
- Created clean boot systems with minimal FCP & fonts installed
- Flattened permissions (ugo=rw), removing any and all ACLs
- Replaced GPUs (now on ATI Radeon HD 5770)
- Moved project to different suites (we have 20)
- Created new user profiles (daily)
- Used applejack (daily) to clean and repair disk issues
- Removed all extended attributes from files (we're on an Xsan volume (v2.2.1) without EAs enabled, therefore EAs create ._ files for resource fork storage).

There's probably some more actions taken which aren't listed, but you can see we've been pretty exhaustive! However everything tried has failed to remove this persistent hanging of FCP. We're seeing exactly the same malloc system.log entries as mentioned by the original poster, which occur during renders, we'll often see system.log files with >500k lines! I've asked Apple System Engineers and specialists about this, but no one else is reporting this issue, so there's no further information out there, except this thread...

To my mind, this is looking very much like an FCP v7 issue, due to the involved nature of this project its not been possible to downgrade to FCPv6 and retry. Our client is on a very short fuse now about the whole situation (understandably).

Our last ditch attempt has been to move the project in its entirety to its own SAN volume (at great expense, as you might imagine), we're using the same SAN fabric and network and metadata controllers, but different storage. After two full days working, this appears to be easing the problems with only one hang event in only one suite, as opposed to 5-6 daily for each suite!

No other project is experiencing this issue, and we have projects using the same workflow and codecs, on the same storage and the same hardware.

If anyone feels they have any additional information/suggestions I'd be very interested to hear more.

Here's the current hardware details for the 3 suites in use:
Suite18
Hardware:
Hardware Overview:
Model Name: Mac Pro
Model Identifier: MacPro4,1
Processor Name: Quad-Core Intel Xeon
Processor Speed: 2.26 GHz
Number Of Processors: 2
Total Number Of Cores: 8
L2 Cache (per core): 256 KB
L3 Cache (per processor): 8 MB
Memory: 6 GB
Processor Interconnect Speed: 5.86 GT/s
Boot ROM Version: MP41.0081.B07
SMC Version (system): 1.39f5
SMC Version (processor tray): 1.39f5
Serial Number (system): CK007
Serial Number (processor tray): J5952
---------------------------------------------------------
Graphics/Displays:
ATI Radeon HD 5770:
Chipset Model: ATI Radeon HD 5770
Type: GPU
Bus: PCIe
Slot: Slot-1
PCIe Lane Width: x16
VRAM (Total): 1024 MB
Vendor: ATI (0x1002)
Device ID: 0x68b8
Revision ID: 0x0000
ROM Revision: 113-C0160C-155
EFI Driver Version: 01.00.436
=========================================================
=========================================================
Suite19
Hardware:
Hardware Overview:
Model Name: Mac Pro
Model Identifier: MacPro4,1
Processor Name: Quad-Core Intel Xeon
Processor Speed: 2.26 GHz
Number Of Processors: 2
Total Number Of Cores: 8
L2 Cache (per core): 256 KB
L3 Cache (per processor): 8 MB
Memory: 6 GB
Processor Interconnect Speed: 5.86 GT/s
Boot ROM Version: MP41.0081.B07
SMC Version (system): 1.39f5
SMC Version (processor tray): 1.39f5
Serial Number (system): CK009
Serial Number (processor tray): J5001
---------------------------------------------------------
Graphics/Displays:
NVIDIA GeForce GT 120:
Chipset Model: NVIDIA GeForce GT 120
Type: GPU
Bus: PCIe
Slot: Slot-1
PCIe Lane Width: x16
VRAM (Total): 512 MB
Vendor: NVIDIA (0x10de)
Device ID: 0x0640
Revision ID: 0x00a1
ROM Revision: 3386
=========================================================
=========================================================
Suite20
Hardware:
Hardware Overview:
Model Name: Mac Pro
Model Identifier: MacPro4,1
Processor Name: Quad-Core Intel Xeon
Processor Speed: 2.26 GHz
Number Of Processors: 2
Total Number Of Cores: 8
L2 Cache (per core): 256 KB
L3 Cache (per processor): 8 MB
Memory: 6 GB
Processor Interconnect Speed: 5.86 GT/s
Boot ROM Version: MP41.0081.B07
SMC Version (system): 1.39f5
SMC Version (processor tray): 1.39f5
Serial Number (system): CK009
Serial Number (processor tray): J5001
---------------------------------------------------------
Graphics/Displays:
NVIDIA GeForce GT 120:
Chipset Model: NVIDIA GeForce GT 120
Type: GPU
Bus: PCIe
Slot: Slot-1
PCIe Lane Width: x16
VRAM (Total): 512 MB
Vendor: NVIDIA (0x10de)
Device ID: 0x0640
Revision ID: 0x00a1
ROM Revision: 3386

My Raid card failed and I had that and the video card replaced. Haven't as yet given the machine much of a test. Though perhaps the Raid card was the problem. However it did crash the once I tested it with Final Cut. But I've been away for several weeks so haven't been using the machine so have no idea if the thing has improved its general performance.

How big is your project file? The malloc error indicates that Final Cut Pro may be running out of memory. Remember that even though you have 16 GB of RAM, only 4 GB can be addressed by Final Cut Pro. 1.5 GB is reserved for frameworks so a maximum of 2.5 GB can be used for your project.

My software:
Pro Maintenance Tools - Tools to keep Final Cut Studio, Final Cut Pro X, Avid Media Composer and Adobe Premiere Pro running smoothly and fix problems when they arise
Pro Media Tools - Edit QuickTime chapters and metadata, detect gamma shifts, edit markers, watch renders and more
More tools...

Project file sizes being affected range from a few KB to 80-90MB.

A couple of thoughts:

- Have you tried using a 2008 or 2009 Mac Pro and running FCP 7.x.x on Mac OS X 10.5.8 (I don't know
if a 2010 Mac Pro would run 10.5, though it isn't likely)? I still see some "weird" (good technical term)
"issues" with 10.6.x while running FCP 7.x.x. As Lawrence mentioned earlier, I also see some funkiness
(another technical term) with various plugins on occasion. I have two identical systems, one running 10.5
and the other 10.6. For me, the 10.5 setup is more stable (again, possibly unreliable anecdotal evidence).

- Another test may include setting up a system with only local storage (a large enough RAID with plenty of
extra space). This may help determine if the issue is possibly SAN-related. I realize that you probably intend to use
more than one system at-a-time for actual editing, but this may help to diagnose things.


-Dave

I just remembered a problem I ran into a few months ago. The company had a similar issue where the project would beachball for a good hour or so before opening successfully. After much head-scratching, we eventually managed to narrow it down to a particular clip that opened just fine in QuickTime (hence why Corrupt Clip Finder didn't find it) but Final Cut Pro had difficulty because it was reading the file incorrectly.

This file had been created by exporting a reference movie from a Final Cut Pro timeline which was opened up in QuickTime Player and saved as a self-contained movie. It seemed that the errors were introduced into the file when it was made self-contained from media files contained on the Xsan. After implementing a policy to not use reference movies that link to media on the Xsan, the beachballing problems went away.

D-Mac Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> (I don't know if a 2010 Mac Pro would run 10.5,
> though it isn't likely)?

It's best not to install an operating system earlier than the one the system was originally designed for.

My software:
Pro Maintenance Tools - Tools to keep Final Cut Studio, Final Cut Pro X, Avid Media Composer and Adobe Premiere Pro running smoothly and fix problems when they arise
Pro Media Tools - Edit QuickTime chapters and metadata, detect gamma shifts, edit markers, watch renders and more
More tools...

Jon Chappell Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> D-Mac Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > (I don't know if a 2010 Mac Pro would run 10.5,
>
> > though it isn't likely)?
>
> It's best not to install an operating system
> earlier than the one the system was originally
> designed for.

Thanks for clarifying that. I know that you aren't supposed to run an OS version earlier than
that which shipped with a particular Mac (that's why I mentioned using a 2008 or 2009 Mac Pro
to test with 10.5.x.). No need to further confuse matters by running an unapproved setup
(i.e., a 2010 Mac Pro with 10.5.x, if the Mac Pro would even boot)...



-Dave

Just to clarify - it's ok to install an earlier version than the one it shipped with, as long as it is not earlier than the OS it was designed for. For example, the 2009 Mac Pros were originally designed for Leopard and then Snow Leopard came out afterwards. So even though they started shipping with Snow Leopard, it was ok to install Leopard on them because the hardware support existed in the previous OS. But the 2010 Mac Pros were designed specifically for Snow Leopard so there is no guarantee that the hardware will be supported in earlier versions.

My software:
Pro Maintenance Tools - Tools to keep Final Cut Studio, Final Cut Pro X, Avid Media Composer and Adobe Premiere Pro running smoothly and fix problems when they arise
Pro Media Tools - Edit QuickTime chapters and metadata, detect gamma shifts, edit markers, watch renders and more
More tools...

Quote

opened just fine in QuickTime (hence why Corrupt Clip Finder didn't find it) but Final Cut Pro had difficulty because it was reading the file incorrectly

Hey Jon didn't Rami have a similar to the issue on a large project that turned out to be a one corrupt audio file?

When these issues arise its easy to blame a large file or complex project but I've worked on some amazingly huge and complex projects over Xsan and on local RAID storage and never a blip.

I agree with D-Mac (Dave) and would do as he suggested and definitely rule out a pipeline problem with the SAN and network. I read you moved just the SAN volume but not the whole setup. Do test your MacPros as separate systems from the network so you can definitely rule out that part of the equasion.

Have you checked the integrity of the drives in the SAN's RAID? I always thoroughly test every HDD I put in my RAIDs and then the RAID array itself (until they bleed!) with diglloydTools [diglloydtools.com] before I put any important data on them.

Your issue certainly reminds me of the hangs that people used to get with LaCie BigDisks which often have a bad cable connection, Maxtor HDD mechs and/or overheat and FCP would hang (sometimes the whole system as well) but sometimes came back when you yanked the drive. (I do not advise yanking the connection!) But the upshot was that if it was a bad disk - as long as you didn't access that file or that part of the disk then everything was fine.



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]

Ben King Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hey Jon didn't Rami have a similar to the issue on
> a large project that turned out to be a one
> corrupt audio file?

Not sure... I didn't hear about that one.

But while FCP uses QuickTime for a lot of things, it would appear that Apple has written their own code for certain functions (perhaps because it was written before these features were introduced into QuickTime) and this custom code can introduce new bugs that are not present when the file is opened with QuickTime Player.

For instance, Final Cut Pro expects multiple ImageDescription extensions to be in a format that is contrary to what is written in the QuickTime specifications. So if you write the file according to the specs, it will crash Final Cut Pro but not QuickTime. If you add some extra zeroes, Final Cut Pro handles the file just fine and QuickTime ignores the error.

So the definition of "corrupt" can vary depending on which application you are using.

My software:
Pro Maintenance Tools - Tools to keep Final Cut Studio, Final Cut Pro X, Avid Media Composer and Adobe Premiere Pro running smoothly and fix problems when they arise
Pro Media Tools - Edit QuickTime chapters and metadata, detect gamma shifts, edit markers, watch renders and more
More tools...

Yeah, any corrupt media can cause problems like that. Most common are corrupt video (especially unorthodox ones like screen captures, downloads, and DVD extractions), then graphics, then audio. Even a resave or reconversion can't always get rid of corruptions.


www.derekmok.com

Reference movies would always be a no-no in my book from previous experience, however, do you have any ideas as to how I might find a single (or multiple) reference movie file amongst 17,000+ files? I guess there may be some method using Quicktime's APIs, but any other suggestions would be welcome

In response to D-Mac, we did try running the project off of a Fibre Channel DAS RAID, but still saw the same issues unfortunately.