FCP media management question

So I had a two issues at work yesterday as I got sucked into some work typically done by the AE. I will describe the issue, then how I would have solved it in the Avid and how I tried to solve it in FCP and if someone can tell me how I went wrong or what I could have done better that would be appreciated. Sorry to bring Avid into the mix but it's what I know best and I am still learning FCP so Avid is my best frame of reference.

1/ The issue: So I was putting together a bloopers reel for a 16 episode series. Each episode had a reel already assembled by that episodes editor so all I was doing was making a master stringout. Two of the reels had been taken offline. So I went to batch digitize those two reels and I realized that the footage had been loaded by a PA and he had not entered the reel numbers into the logging info. He entered some kind of random note in the reel number column like "Chicago" or "A Camera Day" Luckily he had entered the reel number into the name of the clips.

2/ What I would do in Avid: I would decompose the sequence and change the tape numbers with the modify function then batch the clips.

3/ How I tried to solve it: I manually tracked down the clips in the project and changed the reel numbers in the bin and tried to batch but it still asked for the old reel info which was in no way referencing the tape number. So the modification didn't take. I could have batched if the PA labeled things consistently wrong. Meaning if only tape 505 ( labeled in the name column ) was named "Chicago" in the reel column I could have cross referenced but several tapes were named that etc ... so there was no way to do that. So I then tried to batch each clip separately in the timeline by right clicking and batch but it wanted to take the whole clip. The clips were loaded as whole tapes so that wasn't an option, to load several one hour clips for a thirty second sequence. So what I did was I subclipped and loaded the subclips individually ( name of tape on clip name ) and recut them in manually.

So my question is. What would have been the most efficient way to solve this?

Second issue;

1/ The issue: I needed to consolidate all of this media to one drive ( for good housekeeping ) since the entire sequence was referencing like 20 drives. I wanted to make a copy of the media with small handles, not the whole clip and not deleting the original.

2/ What I would do in Avid: Consolidate, set handles and deselect delete media when done.

3/ What I tried to do was go to the media manager to do this but the only way I could set handles ( in no way do I want to copy the entire master clip ) was to to select delete media when finished or something like that. Does this mean, by delete, that it will just not include the media outside the handles therefore making a copy of just what I need or will it go back and delete the master clips? Basically what I need to know how to do is to consolidate a sequence but just what I need of the sequence, making new clips not referencing the old master clips and not deleting the old master clips. Anyway, I chose the delete option because that is the only way I could set handles and it started to run after about two hours of this process ( the sequence was like 90 minutes ) I felt as if it was taking too long and I didn't do it right. My shift was over and I went home and let it keep going.

So my questions are: Am I going to come in Monday to a bunch of angry editors because I deleted master clips across 16 episodes or will it have done what I wanted it to do? Is there an option for deselecting media already on target drive and if not why not, seems pretty basic? Can someone explain the differences between Avid and FCP in terms of consolidating?

Thanks.

Ordinarily, you should have been able to change just the Reel Name of one instance of the clips. FCP should ask you "this would modify the file on disk". Click OK on that and all the Reel Names of every reference to that clip should have updated. If this didn't work, that means your master-affiliate relationships are broken. But that still should not have been crippling, because changing a Reel Name of a group of clips in the Browser is as easy as changing one of them, and then highlighting all of them and CONTROL-clicking to select the updated Reel Name.

And, to take a few more steps back, did you already check to make sure the file was, in fact, missing and not just disconnected? A recapture may not have been necessary.

> My shift was over and I went home and let it keep going.
> Am I going to come in Monday to a bunch of angry editors because I deleted master clips
> across 16 episodes

You ran Media Manager on the entire thing without ascertaining this? And before you actually got an answer from the people you're consulting?

Meaning no disrespect, but I think you're being overconfident if you're not completely familiar with the functions you're using and what results will come.

Why didn't you test one clip, or five clips in a test timeline? Use the Media Manager settings, test one clip. It will finish in a matter of minutes. Then you check to make sure the files and results are what you'd wanted. If not, one to five clips would be easy to salvage; if yes, then you can do the entire 90-minute timeline, leave it running and go home. Why would you run a media-altering process on all 16 episodes worth of master clips if you weren't sure it wouldn't permanently damage the original show media?


www.derekmok.com

Sounds like the assistants need a good ear bashing (if they're assistants but they're not properly logging the media and putting them in the right location, what are they doing?) But it's not a show stopper. Change the reel number in the browser as Derek mentioned. The clips should be updated when the other editors launch their projects.

Quote

1/ I wanted to make a copy of the media with small handles, not the whole clip and not deleting the original.

Select sequence, MM, place into a new project, "copy", check delete unused media, set handles to 1:00, set media destination. And let it run.

When you're done, you'll have a folder with the trimmed clips, and a new project file that links to that folder.

As long as you're in the 'copy' mode, you're not deleting anything. If you're in the 'move' mode, it's destructive. One of the things you need to make sure, is that all the clips are named properly- no illegal characters and no long file names. MM may generate error messages in those cases.



www.strypesinpost.com

In response to Derek:

Totally offline and not relinkable. I actually used the reel name modification you described, it worked in terms of the bin but when I went to batch it still asked for the old info it was logged as. Still a mystery. Oh, and in terms of doing a test, I did ask another editor, a guy who had been at the company for years and he said it was okay to consolidate the way I did but I didn't totally trust him as one should always be skeptical when you are messing about with media management and I probably should have done a test yes so I guess I do deserve a bit of a lashing. It was a little frustrating anyway because I usually have a bevy of rock star assistants and this project is a bit low budget so the setup is a bit different.

In response to Strype. It's one of those gigs where the assistants are really post pa's and shouldn't really be loading. Oh well, watcha gonna do? Thanks, great advice, that clears allot of things things up. Let me ask, that method works great for consolidating but was there a way to "decompose" an offline sequence or just break it down as a log? Maybe export an edl than reimport, something like that?

Thanks for the help guys.

> I did ask another editor, a guy who had been at the company for years and he said it was okay
> to consolidate the way I did but I didn't totally trust him

You should get into the habit of testing things. Even if the advice you got from the other editor is spot on, the fact that you haven't used that tool before is enough of a threat. One wrong setting (as strypes mentioned) and you will have altered the media irrevocably.

Since you mentioned 20 separate storage drives, I assume you're not using networked storage. Which means I believe the initial approach to collecting these reels was faulty to begin with. I would have recommended that each editor of each episode use the Media Manager on their own. That way you can have, say, four separate systems doing the job at once, and each editor is familiar with his own media, which reduces chances of mistakes. And then you can just use a new media drive to shuttle from station to station, copying only the necessary media. That way when you work, you're using an expendable copy of the media, not the originals on which their shows were based.

For gag reels, it may not even have been absolutely necessary that the clips should be trimmed. Just copy the master clips without trimming. Media Manager can do that as well.

Even simpler, should have had them export full-quality, self-contained QuickTime movies, if you're not changing their edits.

> was there a way to "decompose" an offline sequence or just break it down as a log?

We don't say "decompose" in FCP land. I don't know why you'd want to do that in your case, but if you wanted the clips in a timeline as logs, just drag them back into a bin in the Browser, take them offline if they're not already (SHIFT-D), and set that bin as the Logging Bin for recapture. Bear in mind that this method will yield duplicates (each instance of the affiliate will become a new master), so some cleanup is necessary, but FCP will do that for you to some extent -- it will tell you there is "more than one reference" to a certain clip and ask if you want to link them all to the same captured media.


www.derekmok.com

Or you can use Media Manager. First, duplicate your sequence, select everything in your timeline (apple A), right click, "make independent clip", then run MM, "make offline", select the codec you want to recapture as (eg. Uncompressed 10 bits), select handles, and let it run. But do a short test on one clip.



www.strypesinpost.com

Thanks, and I will do a test ...

While you are answering questions do you know how to make markers lock to the footage in the timeline and not sequence timecode. Putting in locators oops I mean markers as notes while screening doesn't do much good if they all get busted out of sync after doing the first note. I usually duplicate the sequence one as a reference and one as a cut and toggle. If there isn't a way to do it I will probably just throw the sequence up as source when I get upgraded to version seven which has reverse matchframe. I actually looked in the manual for this and didn't see anything.

Use version 7. You could also add the marker to the clip rather than the timeline ruler.

All the best,

Tom

What Tom means is that FCP7 now has the option of "rippling markers" -- markers that respond to ripple operations in the timeline and move with the changes you make. I don't think the feature is perfected yet, though, so I never use it -- for what you're describing, I still use markers on the clip.

And in case you didn't know, to make a marker on a clip, you can use the timeline playhead. Just select the clip before hitting M.


www.derekmok.com

Thanks ya'll very helpful. The ripple marker thing will be cool.

The markers can also be color coded. I only wished they could tag the colors to keystrokes rather than mouse clicks.

To add to Derek's comments, to go to the next sequence marker, you hit shift and up or down arrow. To go to the next clip marker, select all (cmd A), shift up/down.



www.strypesinpost.com

> I only wished they could tag the colors to keystrokes rather than mouse click

Strypes, you can create different-coloured markers by pressing OPTION-1, 2, 3 and so on (going from memory -- don't have FCP7 at home). I do wish you could change the colours with those same keystrokes, though.

====CORRECTION====

Sorry, it's SHIFT-1, 2, 3, 4...8 in the timeline for multi-coloured markers. And as aforementioned, you can't change the colour once it's created without going into the marker menu; there's no one-stroke shortcut. But you can still use just the keyboard on a pre-existing marker -- APPLE-` (delete current marker), then SHIFT-1-8 for the multi-coloured markers. Still fussier than I'd like. SHIFT-1-8 should override the current colour, without altering marker notes.


www.derekmok.com

rippling markers:

this works if you do EDITS in the timeline as opposed to grabbing and moving chunks around.
as an avid person, this should be fine for you.

to be (a bit) more precise: by EDITS in the timeline i mean:
performing ripple edits, using ripple tool or trim window,
ripple deletes (extraction's in avid) (shift + delete or forward delete) and ripple / insert paste (shift v... you know, like apple v is an "overwrite" paste)
and insert edits (F9)

all of these operations will move the markers

a common FCP thing is to select all forward using the track tool and move huge chunks of timeline around.
this will NOT move the markers.

i've been using coloured markers to denote VFX in my latest show.
i'm using "extended" markers, where they "stretch out" and indicate a section of the timeline,
and at times there are quite a few overlapping.

i found it was really slowing down my frame by frame scrubbing, especially when zoomed in.
then i remembered about the PROJECT PROPERTIES window.
found under the Edit Menu
in that window you can turn individual marker colours on or off. they still are there, just invisible.



media manager:

Quote

does this mean, by delete, that it will just not include the media outside the handles therefore making a copy of just what I need or will it go back and delete the master clips?

it means the former.
but watch out for MOVE or USE EXISTING modes in MM
both those will delete the original media.
don't use them for consolidating, use COPY


nick

> this works if you do EDITS in the timeline as opposed to grabbing and moving chunks around.

Yeah, Nick has pinpointed the exact problem. I'm a grab-and-arrange guy.

I also think they made a mistake making marker rippling a toggle on/off feature. I think it should be built into each marker as to whether it ripples or not. For example, one big application of this is DVD chapter markers, and those you would always want to stay put relative to the scene.

Also, marker Copy/Cut/Paste...is it really too much to ask? That would make rippling almost almost irrelevant, if it were easier to move them around. I understand why they wouldn't want to make this too easy (having to deal with markers as if they were clips would be too much, and will slow down normal editing), but isn't there a way to add a tool that can affect markers with mouse clicks and Copy/Cut/Paste commands? Or an interface you can enter into at will (eg. timeline in "Marker Edit Mode"?


www.derekmok.com

>I think it should be built into each marker as to whether it ripples or not.

Yea. Some markers I do want to be permanent (eg. markers I put to indicate duration, like for a 30 sec spot).



www.strypesinpost.com

Quote
derek
I also think they made a mistake making marker rippling a toggle on/off feature. I think it should be built into each marker as to whether it ripples or not.

could be.
one great thing about turning rippling on & off,
is when (not if) your markers do go out of sync with what they are supposed to be marking,
you can get them back into sync as a group by turning marker-rippling off,
moving your picture to be in sync with the markers (any way you like),
then turning marker-rippling back on and rippling your pic back into place, using one of the "safe" methods

copy/paste markers?
heaven!

i recently rearranged my 4-sequence feature down into 6 sequences.
dealing with all the markers was, lets just say, a challenge.


nick

Quote
Nick Meyers
found it was really slowing down my frame by frame scrubbing, especially when zoomed in.
then i remembered about the PROJECT PROPERTIES window.
found under the Edit Menu
in that window you can turn individual marker colours on or off. they still are there, just invisible.

Ooh that's a good one to know.

I have sometimes wondered why they made it very easy to move a marker (shift-`) down the timeline but not earlier (enter marker edit window, adjust TC manually, enter).
One line of logic would be that mostly one would be removing content from sequences, especially at the using marker stage and therefore, moving markers earlier would be of more use than shifting them down the sequence. Curious.

ak
Sleeplings, AWAKE!

> you can get them back into sync as a group by turning marker-rippling off,
> moving your picture to be in sync with the markers (any way you like),

Ah, but that definitely falls in the "shaving your foot to fit the shoe" category!
FCP designers, are you listening?

> I have sometimes wondered why they made it very easy to move a marker (shift-`) down the
> timeline but not earlier (enter marker edit window, adjust TC manually, enter).

Indeed.
What I do in those cases is that instead of entering the new timecode, I use -[# of frames] to move the marker back too far (so that you don't have to worry about keying in exact numbers). Then I use SHIFT-` to pop it back to where I actually want it.

I suppose you can also copy/paste the timecode number from a variety of places, but it's still too fussy for me. Most of the time, I want my markers in a general area, without the need to be dead frame-specific.

They should make it so you can grab and drag markers by holding down a modifier key. And copy/paste, obviously.


www.derekmok.com

> it's SHIFT-1, 2, 3, 4...8 in the timeline for multi-coloured markers.

Thanks, D.



www.strypesinpost.com

Looks like I have allot to learn and experiment with in terms of markers. Thank's guys. I wonder if there is a marker window you can pull up and sort by color for instance I use source markers more than timeline markers when I deal with verite footage, giving sot's a color, broll a color etc and pull up the window and sort by color and pop through depending on what I am looking for. But then again one advantage I think is see in FCP over the Avid locator window is you do get your markers in a drop down in the bin associated with the clip which is really cool.

In the timeline, select the clips, right click, "label", and choose a color. To rename the labels, hit option Q (user preferences), go to "label". Just make sure you back up your preferences with the FCP preference manager so you don't lose your labels when the preference files go corrupt.

[www.digitalrebellion.com]

This is another hidden FCP feature courtesy of Jon, which I realize a lot of Avid editors do not know of. Customized keyboard shortcuts, screen layouts, presets, can all be easily saved with the preference manager app and loaded onto another machine running the same version of FCP.



www.strypesinpost.com

And speaking of which, does anyone know if the Preference Manager is supported on Tiger/FCP 6?

*Edit* Nevermind. It is.



www.strypesinpost.com

Nick Meyers Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> i've been using coloured markers to denote VFX in
> my latest show.
> i'm using "extended" markers, where they "stretch
> out" and indicate a section of the timeline,
> and at times there are quite a few overlapping.
>
> i found it was really slowing down my frame by
> frame scrubbing, especially when zoomed in.
> then i remembered about the PROJECT PROPERTIES
> window.
> found under the Edit Menu
> in that window you can turn individual marker
> colours on or off. they still are there, just
> invisible.


Great tip. I found extended markers to be slowing FCP too.

- Justin Barham -

strypes Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And speaking of which, does anyone know if the
> Preference Manager is supported on Tiger/FCP 6?
>
> *Edit* Nevermind. It is.

Yep, although Tiger support will be phased out in the next version. There will always be a Tiger version available though, frozen at version 2.0.7.

Also, Preference Manager is written in such a way that it is compatible with FCP version 3 and onwards (perhaps even lower - I couldn't find documentation on older versions). New versions of FCP are automatically compatible without it needing to be updated. So you can safely assume by default that it supports your version of Final Cut Pro, whatever that version may be.

My software:
Pro Maintenance Tools - Tools to keep Final Cut Studio, Final Cut Pro X, Avid Media Composer and Adobe Premiere Pro running smoothly and fix problems when they arise
Pro Media Tools - Edit QuickTime chapters and metadata, detect gamma shifts, edit markers, watch renders and more
More tools...

Thanks, Jon. I'll be needing it for a bunch of machines in Tiger. That app of yours is pure gold.



www.strypesinpost.com

Quote
derek
They should make it so you can grab and drag markers by holding down a modifier key

they have!
hold apple (command) and you can move those markers any which-way.
you have to be careful as you drop the markers in place. you have to drop within the ruler area.
if you move out of the ruler area while dragging it can appear as if you have lost your marker, but you can get it back by moving back into the ruler.

Quote

[# of frames] to move the marker back too far (so that you don't have to worry about keying in exact numbers). Then I use SHIFT-` to pop it back to where I actually want it.

great!

>hold apple (command) and you can move those markers any which-way.

Wow. Awesome! Thanks, Nick!



www.strypesinpost.com

> hold apple (command) and you can move those markers any which-way.

You're right, forgot about that. We still need Copy/Cut/Paste!
Amazing how it took nine years to implement different colours.


www.derekmok.com

And after all those years, I'm now in the habit of setting markers, using them once and then deleting all of them cause they won't shift with the cut. Gonna take me a while to get used to the possibility of rippling. Can they be locked, as Strypes says, for a duration marker?

You don't have to ripple if you don't want to play. There's a button on the timeline next to snap button.



www.strypesinpost.com