re: Live (screen?) capturing

A fellow editor just asked me about this: He needs to capture what I imagine is a live webcam broadcast (interviews), and I think he's using screen-capture software like SnapzPro.

Because the broadcast is a one-time deal, he's asking me whether he should capture at a compressed codec and then blow it up. The interviews will be in 15-minute chunks.

Final delivery is 1080p24, and he said he wanted to do the capture at less than that frame size, but use H.264 for the encoding.

The thing is, as far as I know, H.264 is processor-intensive. Doesn't this mean it is *more* likely to hang up in a live situation than ProRes? My first instinct was to tell him to capture with DVCPro HD or ProRes 422, and at 60i rather than 24p so that he gets more frames to play with.

Any thoughts?


www.derekmok.com

Have him get ScreenFlow. Capture screen size native...it captures the video. And then edit...and then output to whatever format you want. That software is too slick. I use it for all my tutorials now. 5 and counting.


www.shanerosseditor.com

Listen to THE EDIT BAY Podcast on iTunes
[itunes.apple.com]

I like iShowU. It can do 1080, 720, uncompressed 8 bit, NTSC DV - any codec you have installed by the looks of it.

If it was a critical one-time only thing, I personally would be running two computers doing the same job, so any glitches could be perhaps overlapped. And yeah, capture in the highest reasonable quality, edit, then compress. Not capture at worse quality, edit in a non-editing format, then upres. That's counterintuitive.

Thanks for the tips. What about the "hangup" concern? Does ProRes fare well at 1080p24, or should he go with DVCPro HD? Should he capture at 60i to attempt to get better motion, or is that too much more prone to hiccups?

I've used Snapz Pro for years now, but I'm not happy with it. It's prone to losing 30 minutes of screen capture with one wrong button click. I imagine that in his case he also needs to consider turnaround. Snapz Pro is very annoying in that if you capture 15 minutes of material, the clip won't be ready for another 10 to 25 minutes and you can't capture anything else without abandoning the previous clip, and I think he might have a problem with that. Do iShowU or ScreenFlow have this problem?


www.derekmok.com

iShowU is instant. There's no post prep time. The only thing that could go wrong is you press abort instead of finish - and they are both next to each other, so it's a possibility.

The new HD versions says :
"Includes built-in presets for Final Cut. Finished recordings can be dragged directly from iShowU HD into the timeline. (HD Pro only)"

I've only got the standard app, so I know nothing about the HD or HD pro, but it's been very reliable, affordable and useful for me.

ScreenFlow captures the video signal, unprocessed. You export what you want from that. VERY little chance of video stopping or aborting. There is a demo, you can always try it out.


www.shanerosseditor.com

Listen to THE EDIT BAY Podcast on iTunes
[itunes.apple.com]

Ditto on iShowU! video and audio are great. you select just what you need to capture.
Alberto

I Show U

------------------------
Dean

"When I see you floating down the gutter I'll give you a bottle of wine."
Captain Beefheart, Trout Mask Replica.

Screenflow seconded. Very flexible.

- Loren

Today's FCP 7 keytip:
Play from Playhead to Out Mark with Shift-P !

Your Final Cut Studio KeyGuide? Power Pack.
Now available at KeyGuide Central.
www.neotrondesign.com

Hi,
I'm a teacher and I use digital media in my courses.
I was pretty psyched to see this post as I'm just starting to use iShowU HD pro to make a series of tutorials for a course I'm teaching. Right now I'm a little stumped as I have been trying to test each preset and figure out what will give me the best quality in FCP. Once it's in FCP I add some audio, a logo and titles etc.
Should the sequence settings in FCP and the Quicktime export be exactly the same?
Eventually, they will be posted on to a blog I created for the class, which means they link from a server somewhere. This is a stop-motion animation course and the tutorials are specifically designed to help students with their projects. I keep trying different settings but any suggestions would be great.
Thanks

I would capture ProRes, edit with that, then export a quicktime movie at current settings, and then use mpeg streamclip to create a h.264 mpeg4.

Prores is a good editing codec, especially if you intend to add graphics.
MP4 is a good delivery codec for the web.

This is where I need help understanding exactly what ProRes is.

Is it the preset in iShowu and FCP that is 1280x720 and/or 1920x1080?
I also see an "intermediate" 1280x720 and/or 1920x1080.

When you say edit with that, do you mean keep the sequence settings exactly the same?

As you can tell I'm new at this.

Thanks

My content needed to be re-sized on my 1680x1050 screen. I made that content around 1280x720 and captured @ that size. I experimented with different codecs.
So far the one that looks the best is apple "intermediate" 1280x720. Things are definitely looking better. Also, I'm capturing at 15 frames, which was suggested by someone else. Does this make sense?
I'm still not sure what ProRes is as I tried DVCPRO50 and it was fuzzy looking. Again I'm unfamiliar with all the codecs.
Thanks again

Are you on FCP or FC Express? You should have access to Apple Pro res if you're on Pro - unless, which version of FCP are you using?

Hi, I'm on FCP(Academic) 5.1.4

I Googled Apple Pro Res and now understand why it might be a good solution. It definitely is not on my version of FCP and the Academic versions are notorious for
little or no upgrades. Is there a way to install ProRes or do I need to purchase the next level of FCP?
I usually use the Animation codec but I am interested in trying out your suggestion.

You need to purchase FCP6 or later. Animation is really not a good codec fot this in my experience.

All the best,

Tom

Ok I'll look into this but I'm on a tight budget. What about the Apple Intermediate 720p codec, which I have? It seems pretty good on test. Is the Pro Res significantly better? I'll look to see if anyone in my area has the ProRes and check it out.
Best, John

Yes, Intermediate is the solution before prores came out, so it should be fine for your purposes. .

Thanks for staying with this.
I'll use "Apple intermediate"which does look good for this project.
I need to become more familiar with the range of codecs that exist. Any tutorials or resources on this subject or is it trial and error?

Well, you could check out the LAFCPUG 'tutorials', 'training' and the 'store' section. There are lots of resources there, although I don't know off the top of my head anywhere that lists every codec and what it is for. In my FCP, for example there are .. let me count them .. around 180 different codecs, give or take a couple since it was difficult to count the dropdown menu. A lot of them are different versions of the same thing, so, an NTSC version and a PAL version - different frame sizes, different frame rates, and so on.

You probably won't use more than four or five different kinds in your working life, unless you're in a very busy post house that deals with all sorts of different clients needing transfers. Most people have their own gear already, and only need to deal with the same (or similar) process over and over again. Once you figure out the workflow that's right for you, you can stick with it until something in the production chain changes.

Right.
Up to this point I used Animation, PNG r photoJPEG for everything I was doing(mostly animation).
I'll need to expand my knowledge base around these things.
Thanks again.

The number of codecs used for video acquisition seems to grow faster than any book could get out the door to compare them all. Codec developers describe their codecs though and each will tout why their's is better.

Generally a flavor of Apple ProRes is becoming the "go to" codec. While encoding is only supported on the Mac and certain hardware devices, playback is cross platform. It's almost as good as uncompressed and its I Frame so it's easy to handle by most systems. The files are large but not as large as the various uncompressed varieties are.

Mac without FCP (with iMovie only for example) can encode to Apple Intermediate Codec which is a bit more compressed but still easy to work with as it's also I frame based. Playback is Mac only as well.

Basically for professional work, go to Pro Res and you'll be "safe."

You could read this and then spin your mind off in about 100 directions to cover all the variants and comparisons. This is woefully incomplete too IMHO.
[en.wikipedia.org]

And if you want the basics for AVC
[en.wikipedia.org]

And MPEG2 such as XDCAM and related
[en.wikipedia.org]

All of this is very helpful. I'll start looking into it.
Thanks

I am now using Apple Intermediate 720p to record the screen tutorials I am making for my class.
I am assuming the "p" stands for progressive?
Since these will be posted online I am also assuming this is the right selection.

Also, I am placing these recorded files into my time-line and keeping the Apple Intermediate p setting for the sequence.
Once I have rendered and edited these sequences I am exporting using h264.

Does this all make sense?
Since I am uploading to Vimeo these files are getting compressed again in h264, which makes me wonder if I should export out of FCP using the original Apple Intermediate p setting.

I hope this all makes sense. The final videos look pretty good but I just waned to make sure my process.

That's a reasonable workflow. If you have Final Cut Studio installed you could use Apple Pro Res (you can with Telestream ScreenFlow).
For Vimeo if you're uploading H.264 use about 5000kbps to make your H.264 so it survives another round of compression they do. They've recently increased the maximum single file upload size and mention that some might want to send the master file rather than compress. It might only be for Premium accounts though.

Thanks,
I have FCP Academic (version 5.4), which does not have Pro Res.
My budget is tight so it may be awhile when I can purchase a new FCP.
The h264 info(using 5000kps) is very helpful.
Thanks