Out of sync

I've been using FCP for over 8 years. This is the first time I've had this issue. Here it is:

I shoot on tape. Using a Sony DSR 45 or 11 I import the clips into FCP 6.06. I double click into the viewer and begin playing it back. Slowly, the audio and video move out of sync. I put the clip into the timeline - it's still out of sync.

Don't have a clue why this is happening.

I've played back other edited programs just to double check and there is no sync problem.

I've swapped decks and the same sync problem occurs.

I've imported the same footage on my home system - no sync problem.

Any suggestions? I'm really stumped and I'm now moving close to a deadline.

Thanks -

Margo

Are you trying to capture a whole tape as one clip? Not a good practice.

Also, what kind of storage drive are you using to store the captured clips? You also didn't say what settings you used to capture the clips.

You're looking in the wrong place. It's highly improbable that the tapes and the deck are the problem. Did you check the tapes without a computer in the equation -- ie. played the tapes to a broadcast monitor?


www.derekmok.com

Hi Derek -

I have always captured all footage as one clip. I read your answer from 2010 and captured several clips running about 1-2 minutes. Still out of sync. Then I took the clips and exported them as QT movies self contained. They play perfectly. I dragged them back into FCP and they still are perfectly in sync. So that's what I'm doing now.

Audio is 48hz on camera and FCP. I have the settings at basic NTSC. The tapes look fine on a broadcast monitor - like I said, they export perfectly on my home system.

I have a GSafe as my external drive, but I'm beginning to think I don't have enough oomph left on this old G5.

It's really frustrating and I appreciate your quick response. Any other suggestions?

Thanks again -

Margo

> I read your answer from 2010 and captured several clips running about 1-2 minutes. Still out of sync. Then I took the clips and exported them as QT movies self contained.
> They play perfectly.

That suggests to me there's something wrong with your monitoring method. Clips that are out of sync do not just come back into sync. Are you watching the video and audio at the same source (capture card, deck level, or FCP playback)?


www.derekmok.com

FCP playback.

Did you check audio and video at the same source?

For example, if you're trying to listen to audio from your computer (Built-In Playback), but are watching the video on an external monitor (FireWire), they won't sync. In fact, if you're listening to audio at the FCP Built-In Audio level, you need to turn off External Video.


www.derekmok.com

How are the audio video getting to your broadcast monitor and speakers? I have see problems like this when the settings for the capture card do not agree with the source video and timeline. Some cards will do their best to keep up even when being told bad info about what to put out. Make sure your capture card settings in FCP and the cards control panel are set to the video type you are using. It sounds like DV in either NTSC or PAL from your post.

What's odd about this issue is that I have been using this system, these settings and this equipment for several years. I can only think I inadvertently changed a setting in FCP.

In the meantime - here's the info on my capture information.

Using DV Video for video input
DCR-TRV900 using NTSC
29.97 frames per second
DV-NTSC at Best quality
24 bits per pixel
720 by 480
Using DV Audio for audio input
Input: First 2 channels
Speaker: off
Volume: 100, Gain: 0
Using logged clip setting for picture, gain and media to be captured.

I have external speakers I use for monitoring all audio. I don't use the internal Mac speakers.

I have a sinking or "syncing" suspicion this problem can't be resolved on this forum. But if you have ANY other suggestions, I'll happily test them.

Thanks for your support. I work without FCP peers and I really appreciate these forums!

Margo

> I have external speakers I use for monitoring all audio. I don't use the internal Mac speakers.

Irrelevant. If the speakers are still plugged into the Mac audio outputs, then it's still Built-In Audio you're listening to. If you're listening to that audio, combined with video out from a capture card or FireWire through a deck, they won't sync. That's further complicated if you use USB or FireWire out to a mixer, which introduces another layer of potential latency.


www.derekmok.com

But then - why would this all begin suddenly? After having used the same equipment, same system, same set-up for several years? And why, when I export to QT and reimport does everything work properly? Would stand to reason that has nothing to do with the monitoring of my sound!

If this was indeed your problem, then it's because QuickTime Player doesn't play out through a capture card or FireWire. If you were playing in QuickTime Player, your video is at the computer level and so is your audio.

As I've said, if you have true sync problems arising from out-of-sync media, it doesn't go away no matter how many generations you go. Random computer playback issues do not magically correct out-of-sync video and make it perfect again.

As for why you're seeing it now, there's no way to tell because we don't know what your workflow has been. We don't know whether this is your first dialogue show. We don't know if you dumped preferences so your monitoring setup changed without you noticing. The only person who can answer that question is you.


www.derekmok.com

Well there you have it.

How full are all your hard drives? The fact that it was stable and has happened out of the blue without you changing or updating anything (you didn't, right?) means it could be that your drives are filling up and it just can't handle synced playback anymore on the timeline.

Also, if you export to QuickTime, then re import and it works fine, you've simplified the pressure on playback, so that's a sign that it's to do with the grunt the computer is able to manage.

What happens if you play for a few seconds, then stop, then play, then stop, then play and so on? Does the work stay in sync if it's not asked to play back for an extended amount of time? Does it start out of sync and then right itself a bit?

It could also be that some of your RAM has taken a dive and you're working with less resources all of a sudden.

All things considered, I like the full drives theory-- especially since your G-Safe is a RAID 1 config.

That means you're essentially serving media from a single 7200 rpm drive, with content mirrored on the other half.

It may also be fragmented, which makes file "bookkeeping" of very long clips even more gruelling for the machine. Asking any external SATA which isn't RAIDed for speed to stay peppy and serve up portions of an hour-long clip (absolutely what Derek said, not good practice!) is bound to become even more challenged as you add more media to it.

It's a theory. All your settings look fine, and normally DV isn;t a challenge. There are two things you can do--

1) Run a file optimizer and give it half a day to connected file fragments into contiguous files.

2) If there's less than 10% overhead (free space) left on the drive, try capturing the same media to a fresh 7200 rpm drive, connected as FW 800 if you can.

- Loren

Today's FCP keytip:

Open A/V Settings with Command-Option-Q !

Final Cut Studio 2 KeyGuide? Power Pack.
Now available at KeyGuide Central.
www.neotrondesign.com

Thanks Loren and Jude. Both of you were kind and helpful. I think there is just too much load on the computer. I'm due for a new one and my company, thankfully, is upgrading my Mac with all the bells and whistles...and even FCP-X. Eeek! I really appreciate both of you taking time to help trouble-shoot. Margo

>>even FCP-X<<

Ouch. Make sure you get a good set of tutorials with that purchase. It's an entirely different beast to the FCP you're used to.

Spawn of the Beast....

I ordered FCP7 - and there's always lynda.com! Thanks guys.

md

Where did you get FCP 7 so long past it's EOL?


Margo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I ordered FCP7 - and there's always lynda.com!
> Thanks guys.
>
> md

It's being traded like some kind of vintage wine or a pack of baseball cards. Nobody ever knew there was a market for dead software. Speaking about dead software, I may have a copy of Word Perfect lying around in my parent's storeroom anyone wants to buy it off me?



www.strypesinpost.com

Wordperfect on my Atari ST! It was my first full-fledged text editor. Loved it! Made by Mormons!

- Loren

Today's FCP 7 keytip:
Advance to next/previous keyframes in a clip with Shift/Option-K !

Your Final Cut Studio KeyGuide? Power Pack
with FCP7 KeyGuide --
now available at KeyGuide Central.
www.neotrondesign.com

It ran on the uberpowerful 286. Couldn't remember if it ran on windows or direct access in DOS.



www.strypesinpost.com

WordPerfect? It ran on both DOS and Windows. I was a die-hard DOS user.


www.derekmok.com