Looping audio in a PSD Menu for SP3?

I read in a thread from long ago that DVD SP2 couldn't have a looping audio track in a PSD menu. Has this changed in SP3?

If so, how can I drop a 15 second loop of audio to play in the back ground of my PSD Main Menu?

Thanks in advance.

Geno

It hasn't changed and it won't change. It's not a DVD SP limitation. You could say it's a limitation of DVDs in general, but that wouldn't be an acurate representation.

The truth is that layered Photoshop menus don't exist at all in the DVD specs. DVD Studio Pro does a clever trick, where it basically creates several menus for the different states, so that they switch from one to another when the user navigates through the button. This is completely transparent or invisible, not just for the user but for the DVD author too! In other words, the user believes that he is navigating through different buttons on a menu, but the truth is he's navigating through a series of twin menus. As you can imagine, there is no way you could have a continous audio track playing back while you jump through different menus, which is what is technically happening behind the scenes. So don't hold your breath for that

If you manually did an operation equivalent to what DVD SP is doing with PSD files (ie, constructing a series of twin menus that automatically switch when the user navigates) you could have audio, but not continous. Because the audio would have to either restart or change when you jump from button to button (menu to menu, actually!). The procedure I just discribed is the technique some people use to add sound effects to button states, but that's exactly why audio wouldn't be continuos. It restarts each time you select a new button/twin menu.
Hope this helps.



Adolfo Rozenfeld
Buenos Aires - Argentina
www.adolforozenfeld.com

Very clearly!!!! Thanks.

But one last question... (for now)

Can you describe HOW audio can play continuously while DVD SP allows button states to change via the overlay mode? It seems to me that if a graphic changes AT ALL on screen, the playhead would jump somewhere (I use PLAYHEAD for lack of a better understanding of the technology) and at that point would disrupt any audio playback.

How do it do it?

At your convenience I'm ready for a little more education.

g-

Geno:
1) Nope Nope Nope I mean, you absolutely can have looping audio and get rollovers change as needed. We all do it everyday!

2) Read this: technically, the graphic doesn't change at all. Why? Because the overlay mode (more properly called "highlights" is not part of the "video" or "graphics". Think about this: how do you think you can turn on or off the subtitles on a DVD without affecting playback? The trick is: the highlights (or the subtitles) are not part of the image at all. They are generated "live" (overlay) by a low res chip on the DVD player. And that's why there are color limitations and why they can exhibit pretty bad aliasing. It's a common denominator, low res chip (think Commodore 64, if your age allows that) on every DVD player (emulated in software DVD players, of course).



Adolfo Rozenfeld
Buenos Aires - Argentina
www.adolforozenfeld.com

Okay... now it's all coming together. I guess I'm just going to have to study some interfaces.

In closing, what you're saying is, we're limited to rectangled shapes with color and opacity settings as our "Button States" if we want audio in the background to loop. (No audio, however, and we can rely on Photoshop techniques to create more sphisticated STATES)

And no way to customize these shapes via alpha channels. No way to import VECTOR shapes as our OVERLAY shapes? No way to create LIVE TEXT and have STYLES (Glows, Shadows, Beveled Edges) as button states?

It's Commodore 64 hell. I get it.

Thanks you for your help.

Geno

"In closing, what you're saying is, we're limited to rectangled shapes with color and opacity settings as our "Button States" if we want audio in the background to loop."

No, I didn't say anything like that. You can have any shape you like, as long as it is square. No, I'm just kidding!

You can have any shape you like, really. But since you're using something similar to the VIC chip (Commodore 64's graphics unit!) it's also true you don't want complex shapes with diagonal lines, because they won't look nice. The trick is in placing the really sophisticated elements in the "real" menu image/animation/video, not in the highlights. Get it?

You see, I believe all this is easier for those of us who come from DVD Studio Pro 1.x.... At that time it was a completely different application (literally, I mean). it was a very capable application, but it was a very professional, "manual" approach. More like web design tools, like Dreamweaver or GoLive, in the sense that you don't do graphics content on them, but rather use them to assemble and bring together content from Photoshop or Flash. Since then, it became a much more "friendlier" application. But while it is succesful at that, it kind of hides many of the creative possibilities for new users. They are still there, but not easy to find because they are hidden/translated under all those presets and button styles (which are not a "real" thing, but a kind of illusion for begginners).



By reverting to the DVD SP 1.x way of thinking (completly there still), the "any shape you want" promise is fulfilled by the use of highlights/overlay maps. An overlay map is a bitmap graphic, where everything that it's not part of the rollover is white and strictly the shapes/highlights/rollovers are black (not for each button, but for the whole screen). Then DVD SP allows you to assign that file as an overlay map for the menu, and assign normal/selected/activated colors (normal is frequently transparent, so it doesn't "exist". When I said "black" and "white" I was simplifying things a bit. There's also a 4 color highlights variant too. But I don't use that and I don't want to make things more complicated.

"(No audio, however, and we can rely on Photoshop techniques to create more sphisticated STATES)"

What the layered menu allows (but few people take advantage of) are "remote rollovers", ie, a visual feedback that's not in (or not only in) the area of the button. For example: You select a "Peter" button on the bottom of the screen, and a photo of Peter appears on another part of the screen. Highlights don't work like that, not only because they can't show photos, but also because the overlay information has to be inside the button area rectangle (spot).

Still, layered menus don't really exist They are highlight menus without the highlights, and automated to switch on user navigation.



Adolfo Rozenfeld
Buenos Aires - Argentina
www.adolforozenfeld.com

"" The truth is that layered Photoshop menus don't exist at all in the DVD specs""

I don't think that is correct. Remember DVD SP 1.0-1.5? Photoshop layered menu's were all that were supported. Well, they did have some sort of highlights to the buttons, but there was no drawing a button in the Canvas or anything else like that, until DVDSP 2.

DVDSP 1 and 2 were completely differnet animals and they both adhered to the DVD Specification.

John: Some jedi is playing a mind trick with you

Of course DVD SP 1.0x supported non layered menus. And yes there was the drawing of the button. What DVD SP added in this area are button shapes, button styles and the ability to type text directly, ie, kinf of a translation of the concept for begginners. But mantaining the old manual technique for those use it. Please go back for a minute to the 1.5 mindset, or manual

Yes, they were completely different animals in everything... but this.
And yes they completely support the DVD Spec. What I mean is that layered PSD files are not part of the specs, and DVD SP (both old and new) just uses them as a basis for a trick (the trick's result is part of the DVD specs!).



Adolfo Rozenfeld
Buenos Aires - Argentina
www.adolforozenfeld.com