FCP switch to Avid Express How Hard?

I JUST!!! found out that a series of live capture for immediate re-broadcast projects that I am scheduled for over the next 2 weeks (starting tomorrow) is using Avid Express systems.

How difficult will it be to get the hang of the basics (capture, cut, export) of Avid Express, knowing that I've used FCP exclusively over the last 6 years?

Thanks Guys!

Steve

I went the other way...Avid to FCP...so I can't really say. Plus I don't know Express and how complex it is. I do know that many FCP editors who try to jump in on shows that use Avid Media Composers tend to get pretty lost and struggle. Those who tried to lie and say that they knew Avid lasted on week.

Starting tomorrow? Did you tell them that you didn't know Avid? There is plenty that is different. Just moving media on the timeline is something that is very different on both machines. I don't think you'll find it to be that easy of a transition. Took me a day just to REMEMBER how to cut on an Avid, when I was dumped in front of one after a 2 year absence.

Good luck.


www.shanerosseditor.com

Listen to THE EDIT BAY Podcast on iTunes
[itunes.apple.com]

Shane,

Thanks! That's what I was afraid of. The producers of the project knew full well that I use FCP, but the other editor uses Avid and that's what they went with. I am taking my system just in case, but I'm afraid that the ingesting will be from sdi uncompressed and I will have to buy a Kona real quick.

Steve

Going from FCP to Avid XPress was a horror for me. I went through it twice -- once in 2002 in Cannes, and once last year cutting a short film and doing a temp sound mix on a feature.

The main thing to know is that you can't just drag things. You have to go into these "modes", usually the Overwrite mode. Also, things don't stay put, and (correct me if I'm wrong here, Avid fellas) video and audio aren't linked by item -- they are linked by track, and it's super easy to put things out of sync or have clips swallowed up by a wrong operation.

If you want, Steven, I can send you a list of shortcuts I'd made up. You can't work Avid without shortcuts, unlike in FCP, where you can get by just with the mouse if you want. Send me a Private Message with your e-mail if you want the list. And good luck...it's gonna be painful!


www.derekmok.com

That is one of the things I hate about avid..having to go into OVERWRITE mode. Pain in the patoot. I remember the first time I touched FCP and tried navigating like I did in Avidland and I kept dragging clips all over the place by accident. Pretty funny.


www.shanerosseditor.com

Listen to THE EDIT BAY Podcast on iTunes
[itunes.apple.com]

It depends how quick you are at picking things up. I learned FCP first, but my work uses Avid so I learned it pretty quickly. I don't give one much of an edge of the other, but there are some key workflow differences that you're gonna need to get used to very quickly or you'll be lost.

As Derek mentioned, no clip linking. Instead there are sync locks on tracks. You're probably best off working with them on because you'll have less audio sync trouble that way.

Overwrite and Insert Segment Modes. If you want to move a clip in the timeline, you enter one of these modes so that you can select a clip. You have to Shift-click to select a video clip's audio track because (see above), no clip linking. Typically what I do is hold down ALT and lasso all the clips I want to move. When you do that you'll automatically enter Segment Mode. Use Insert to splice a clip into a new spot, use overwrite to overwrite.

You can only add one effect to a clip at a time. To add more than one, you have to "step into" the clip. It's kinda hard to explain though.

You can't nest one sequence into another, and you can only have one sequence and project open at a time.

Keyframing is fairly similar, but with an important distinction. Normally you will only be able to move a keyframe up or down. You have to hold ALT down to move it left and right

Oh, and you can't view the audio waveform in the Viewer (Source). Only in the timeline, and only if Sample Plot is turned on.

There are no composite modes.

Using an alpha is different. In the timeline in FCP if you have an alpha that is not embedded into your clip (ie: a black and white piece of video) the protocol is Fill on Top, Alpha clip in middle, and Background on bottom with the Travel Matte Alpha composite mode applied to the Top layer. On Avid, it's Alpha on top, Fill in middle and Background on bottom with a Matte Key effect applied to the Alpha layer.

And clips don't have Motion properties like FCP. You can move them and change the opacity and all that, but only by applying the correct filters.

But despite some major differences, there are much they have in common. Digitizing is simple and you can name your clips while digitizing. Overwrite and Splice (Insert) work the same way. The timeline looks similar and is very customizable. They both have Bins, clips, sequences, filters and transitions. You have trim mode if you want. There's a Viewer and a Canvas and it should feel pretty familliar I'd guess.

The hardest thing for me these days is hitting CTL instead of CMD on the PC.

Good Luck.

Andy

Avid like Apple have very good help manuals on the system - if you get stuck check out the help file on either Mac/PC.

1 tip - you may find on Express that zooming in/out of the timeline is on the up/down of the cursor keys...

Ben



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]

Here's some online tutorials that Avid has for the FCP user.

Avid to FCP

Good luck with it. You might want to also find a forum like this one that can get you out of any holes you might fall into.

I just went and watched some of these tutes and jeez - it gets a bit smug sounding. The one I just heard said basically that because FCP is flawed and has only one icon to represent a project, they 'allow' you to open more than one project at a time, but of course, Avid is better, so you don't need to open more than one project at a time. Yeah, right. Nice logic, Avid.

I wish these things would spend less time trying to downplay the strengths of other programs and more time just explaining how to use their products.

Steven -

This article needs to be updated (FCP now has Multicam, etc) but it holds up on most detail. If you reverse-read the info you'l pick up on how Avid works in relation to FCP.

FCP for Avid Editors:
www.lafcpug.org/feature_avid_to_fcp.html

This article will be updated on Martin Baker's Avid to FCP site, another great resource.

- Loren

Today's Xpress Pro 5.x keytip:
Loop Play In to Out with Control-6 (Alt-6 in Windows)

The XpressPro KeyGuide?: your power placemat.
Now available at
www.neotrondesign.com

Dear god - she needs to read the FCP manual and start learning FCP properly

"eliminates all the problems associated with digitizing into an untitled project..."

I think she ought to avoid Avid and FCP and just use iMovie...

or better still - avoid editing altogether if its just too hard to save a project once you have set it up.

Notice how her voice starts to betray her confidence in Avid Xpress when she talks about the 'interface"

Jude - we should do a parody of this where we have to bleep out ever other word when trying to apply effects, changing insert/overwrite mode, restarting, dealing with crashes, differences in keyboard layout between Avid systems or copying from project to project...



But seriously Steven - it will bug the hell out of you but its good to have Avid as a notch on your skills belt - I still often get corporate jobs on Avid - whilst almost all the Broadcast stuff is FCP.



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]

Quote
This article will be updated on Martin Baker's Avid to FCP site, another great resource.

What?! lafcpug doesnt get an update? Why I oughta...



Michael Horton
-------------------

Lynda.com has Avid 5.5 express training -- OnLINE
so you can watch today- -

On the Lynda .com search Avid -(not listed on home page)

--Jay--

I know Ben - bloody funny. I lost interest after a while but I was wondering how the 'Applying Filters' section would sound. Maybe something like..

"Because FCP doesn't really care about your wrist strength, they make you look at all your filters in the same place. In Avid, you get to stack your effects, which means lots more exciting clicks to get to your effects - and a much more health-giving, life-affirming vigourous workout for you!"

And yeah - the 'FCP to Avid' podcast parody would be a hoot... 'So, what you do is you grab th.. tsk.. dammit .. you go into this mode by clicking this, *then* you grab .. what's this dialogue box? Oh bloody hell. Stupid &^%$* OK. Just ignore that. Now, what you do is..'

Thats brilliant Jude. Oh this would make a good parody. I think I might announce it in next lafcpug newsletter and see if anyone wants to tackle it for a prize.

Michael Horton
-------------------

If you write me a script I'll record a "propa cocknee aksen fer ya!"

Orwoight mayt aow vuh fack jew git vis bladdy fing too insert vah fackin bladdy clip! Avid? It getz roight on moi 'ampton wick! Oi cud be 'avin a billy bragg insted ov cattin on vis fackin bladdy paysee!

Nuffsed - Awroite geeeez!



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]

Am I bovvered? Am I bovvered?!! Face! Bovvered?!

Very funny Jude! Definitely one to look forward to. Really amazing how they manage to turn Avid negatives into positives...

Martin Baker
[www.digital-heaven.co.uk]
Unique plug-ins and tools for Apple Pro Apps

...but is she bovved doh?

Is she Martin? Is she Bovved?



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]

This thread took a very interesting turn........... :-)

Everyone, THANK YOU for your help! As it turns out, I am just overseeing the the work of 2 other editors and what actual editing I will be doing I can do on my system. WHEW!!! wiping the sweat from my forehead! Now going from deathly afraid to smoke & mirrors mode.

Steve

I would like to thank EVERYONE that jumped in on this thread. Well the event is FINALLY over. 11 days in Las Vegas was just WAY TOO MUCH! As it turns out. I ended up directing and producing the daily highlight videos as well as all of the content that was shown on 2 channels of the MGM Grand television system. I was supplied with 2 Avid Editors and 1 camera person, a couple of DigiBeta (NTSC & Pal) decks and 2 Turbo iDDR's. Everything was shot on DigiBeta. Things were coming into us on 4 Satellite downlinks and from the main venue out of a Vista Spyder system.

Anyway... I am SO glad that I was not expected to edit on the provided systems. I spent many 20 hour days watching and trying to figure out "what the heck they were doing"! lots of jumping between windows it seemed. On the other hand, I completed all of the finished products for DVD, Broadcast and Web Delivery, and they were just as stumped watching the work that I was doing on FCP.

At this point I can't say that one system is "better than the other"... just different ways of working. I do feel it is beneficial (NOT required... don't stone me) for real editors making a living to at least have a working knowledge of both systems. I know I will be taking a course on it.

Thanks again to everyone for their valuable input. It's because of people like you that I learn something new EVERYDAY! If anyone is interested check out [www1.nobelbiocare.com] click on the "Filmed Highlights"

Steve