HD monitoring with MXO2+TV

I know the forum has been covering this topic of late, but wanted to focus discussion on a specific question. I wrote yesterday about a new MacPro and HD monitoring with a Matrox MXO and an ACD, and Shane Ross strongly suggested putting a little more money out on the table for an MXO2 (for HDMI out and color bars) and an LCD or plasma TV. That is, skip the ACD (or Dell) route ...

And that sounds smart to me -- fits our needs for basic color grading but bumps us up a level from a DVI on a computer monitor ... and we don't have the budget to a very high-end system ...

So here's the question -- with a new MacPro (or existing late-model MBP) and an MXO2 ($1700), I can monitor with a decent level of color assurance off any LCD or plasma HD TV, right? So ... any specific suggestions for the TV? If my budget for the TV is $1000? $2000?

Oh, and one more thing -- can I go this route with an older tower -- here are the specs [support.apple.com]. That is, will an MXO2 work with an older tower?

Thanks so much for any comments or suggestions! The forum is fantastic ... really educational and saves us dollars and hours pursuing the wrong thing ...
Bradley

It all depends on how you define "decent level of color assurance." Will it be good enough for professional color grading? Christ, no. Will it show you how that picture will look on that television? Yup.

Why did you start a new topic on this?

When I wrote the article about the MXO/ACD, that was the cheapest GOOD option available. Not the best, but better than just the monitor by itself. Close to a broadcast monitor. But now that is old tech, and there are newer and better, and CHEAPER options available.

MXO2 LE is great, and then the PANASONIC PLASMA line of monitors. The ProPlasmas. They run between $1000-$2000. OR, for just $400 more, there is the Flanders Scientific 1706W Pro HD LCD full broadcast monitor. THAT is the monitor to get.

The MXO2 line will not work with G5's. Gotta have a PCIe slot. And G5's are 4 year old tech, gotta go MacPro. The MXO is system agnostic...just need a DVI connection. But again, old tech. ACDs are 6 bit monitors, you want at least an 8-bit, and the ProPlasmas are, and the FSI (flanders) is as well.

"good enough" for what? What are your specific needs/requirements/deliverables?


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>That is, skip the ACD (or Dell) route ...

Yes, because the ACD is consigned to the dustbin of history. There are better and cheaper options (i'm repeating Shane's point, here). The benefits of the MXO is that with it you can simulate what guys will get off a video signal, on a computer screen. That's it.

>I can monitor with a decent level of color assurance off any LCD or plasma HD TV, right?

Look at it from this angle.. Can you monitor SD off a good consumer TV set? Yes. Will you be able to color grade off that? Hell, no. Will you be able to monitor your video better off it than off a computer display? Yes.

The FSI monitors are pretty cool. You get 1:1 pixel monitoring, 8 bit color space (or even 10 bit if you go for the higher end model), 3D LUTs for different color spaces, switchable gamma settings, etc...

Then, you can also look at the BMD Decklink HD Extreme cards, since you're looking at a professional broadcast monitor, and you can monitor off HD-SDI (or HDMI if you so prefer).



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Hello Shane and other posters,

My apologies for starting a new topic ... thought it would be efficient rather than redundant. My thanks for you nonetheless answering in detail -- very very helpful.

Many thanks,
Bradley

>I can monitor with a decent level of color assurance off any LCD or plasma HD TV, right?

The unique thing about the Matrox boxes is their ability to allow you calibrate the HDMI output to better match the color and luminance response of your target display. And as such, despite the naysayers, I would argue that yes indeed, you can monitor with a decent level of color assurance off your LCD or plasma HDTV ( certainly you'll be able to monitor on any LCD or plasma HDTV better than if you did not use the MXO2's calibrated output ).... but the level of "assurance" will be directly related to the quality/suitability of your LCD or plasma HD ... the Matrox approach is certainly clever but its not magic and you need to meet it half way if you want to make the most of it.

Here's the thing tho ... try as you might you'll find it next to impossible to find anyone who will stick their neck out and recommend a specific (cheap) HDTV that will give you that "decent" level of assurance, as no-one really want's to assume that responsibility for your money.

I have an MXO2 and love it to bits. It works really well but I'd have to admit that I currently use it with a pro HD CRT not with a consumer HDTV. If I were going to set up a monitoring solution using an HDTV then I'd previously looked (and liked the look of) the Toshiba Regazza RV and ZV LCD TV series ... native 10 bit 1080p panels with support for HDMI 1.3 / xvYCC Colour Space

Been a while since then (Christmas last year was when I was looking) and there may have been improvements on the scene since then.

Hope it helps
Andy

Quote

try as you might you'll find it next to impossible to find anyone who will stick their neck out and recommend a specific (cheap) HDTV that will give you that "decent" level of assurance

Heck, I'll do it. The post house where I'm working right now ? like literally, right now, tonight ? uses Aquos LCDs in their offline rooms and Bravias in their online rooms.

Not for grading, of course, but as client monitors. They use Cinetals as their god monitors.

Well I am talking about for grading Jeff (shock, horror, gasp) .... and shouldn't you be working? ;-)

>They use Cinetals as their god monitors.

GOD monitors eh? They monitor God? (lol).

Yeah, people want recommendations for HDTVs to use for color correction and grading. And I don't want to stick my neck out, as...well...I haven't had the ability to test various HDTVs for this, against good HD LCDs, as I am...and most if not ALL people here...are working professionals and not review writers with access to ALL the HDTVs that exist out there.

All I can say is that with my Panasonic Pro Plasma, it looked DARN good. Close to what my HD CRT looked. Not spot on, but very close. Better than the MXO/ACD was...


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Oh, for cryin' out loud. Is that another regionalism? You guys don't call your grade-one finishing monitors "god monitors?" It's a figure of speech I've been familiar with for years, but maybe it's less widely understood than I thought. Kinda like "framestore."

Thanks Shane, Andy, Jeff and others ...

Very helpful, and certainly answered our question.

For what it's worth, on this end we work on a variety of things -- we're picture editors for feature and short docs, we've done some corporate and some event stuff, too. If we think we might be going to projection/broadcast and there's any money at all, we'll lock picture and pass things on to a color professional. Makes all the difference.

But for low-budget things that will likely be viewed on a small screen -- probably a computer but maybe on a home/office flat screen (via DVD), we were hoping that we could afford enough of a monitor to take one pass to smooth out color a bit without destroying things.

We can't afford the God monitor, that's out unless in the future we really have the right projects and more money flowing through here. We may be able to stretch to that 17" Flanders ... that would be just what we really were asking about. If we otherwise decide that we need to be just a little shyer with money, we'd go the MXO2/HDTV route -- very good and interesting suggestion. Actually, a MXO2 Mini strikes me as very attractive (low $). At least we'd be in the right color space and we'd also get that sense of how the video is often experienced (TV). And, no, we're no longer thinking of the MXO/ACD route. Didn't realize things at Matrox and things in the industry had pretty much made that irrelevant.

Again, can't say how appreciative we are that this forum is here and that Shane and others are so willing to share ...

Bradley

Shane,

are you talking about that line of Panasonic Plasma monitors ?
Panasonic ProPlasma

but it's 42" minimum if you want true pixel to pixel 1920x1080, right ?

Yes...the 12 series monitors. And yes, 42" minimum. That is a good size. 50" and above is too big for me. But that's me.


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Listen to THE EDIT BAY Podcast on iTunes
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