Can I import movies from Itunes into FCP?

I've read that you can import songs from Itunes into FCP but I've tried but couldn't find a way to import movies I bought on Itunes into FCP. Can anyone help?

Before anyone asks...no, I'm not making money with this, I'm just trying to make some music videos to improve my editing skills.

The fine print in the iTunes terms of service says that you're not allowed to use movies bought from iTunes this way.

> I'm just trying to make some music videos to improve my editing skills.

It's a lot better to try to shoot the footage yourself. If you use big-budget features (and we can't tell you how to), the extremely slick photography will make your editing look better than it really is. Plus, those pieces are already edited, they picked the takes already. And real editing is in large part about filtering out the stuff they haven't used. Just as you don't learn how to direct actors from actors who don't need directing.

This old thread contains some great exercises on shooting to help improve editing skills:

[www.lafcpug.org]


www.derekmok.com

To be perfectly honest with you...whether you are making $$$ with this or not, it's still copyright infringement, illegal and not too smart to ask how to hack it in a public forum.

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

I didn't want to hack it! I didn't know it's protected. I just thought there's some way to import it. If you only have a mini DV camera shooting your own stuff isn't a real alternative and you have to have SOME footage to learn.
Thanks for the link Derek!

> If you only have a mini DV camera shooting your own stuff isn't a real alternative

How come?
I learned by shooting SVHS and Hi-8!
Seriously, you cannot learn editing by cutting primo, perfect footage. You learn by cutting footage that's a mess and gets you working hard to make sense out of it. After that baptism by fire, cutting big-budget, well conceived, well executed footage is peanuts.


www.derekmok.com

hm...makes sense.
But I don't have ppl around me who'd be willing to act (I'm not at Film Academy) and make a short movie or something like that. So I'm on my own...what am I supposed to shoot if there's no one around to act?

> So I'm on my own...what am I supposed to shoot if there's no one around to act?

Friends, dogs, cats, dolls, neighbours, yourself...

Or look for acting classes in your area. Aspiring actors would die to have somebody offer to shoot and edit their scenes for free. Approach indie bands and singers. They'd also love any amount of tape, especially if you can shoot and edit them well.


www.derekmok.com

Animate legos...

Noah

Final Cut Studio Training, featuring the HVX200, EX1, EX3, DVX100, DVDSP and Color at [www.callboxlive.com]!
Author, RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera available now at: [www.amazon.com].
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Katrin1980 Wrote:
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> But I don't have ppl around me who'd be willing to
> act (I'm not at Film Academy) and make a short
> movie or something like that. So I'm on my
> own...what am I supposed to shoot if there's no
> one around to act?

If you really want to learn, go shoot an event and make something besides a documentary out of it. Almost every reel of tape has a story in it, but three good editors will find three different stories.

Shooting helps you edit. When you shoot your own stuff, you already have a head start on cutting cause you know the content and you can "shoot for the edit". Start out by doing something simple like this Canon HF S10 Test shoot (my next camera, btw...it's brilliant):





When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

Damn - shooting makes you appreciate the other side of the production coin!

Not only that but editors who shoot/direct normally do it in a much more streamlined efficient and all covering way than camera only experienced people who normal need to rely more heavily on a shooting script or director/dop to tell them what to do!

Kudos to Joey's comment - When I shoot my shiz looks great - is well framed - is long enough is exposed correctly! Plus I get all the shots I need and edit in my head as I'm recording!

IMHO Good Editors should be consulted at the beginning of a production in my view as it can save time in post because any edit issues from format to coverage should already have been addressed. Certainly any productions I Technically Direct or consult on, have never run over or had issues that could have been avoided. (That is if they did what I said! )


Katrin1980 Wrote:
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> But I don't have ppl around me who'd be willing to
> act (I'm not at Film Academy) and make a short
> movie or something like that. So I'm on my
> own...what am I supposed to shoot if there's no
> one around to act?

Local Amateur Dramatics Clubs or Theatre Schools would jump at the chance of a freebee or a co-pro!

Start thinking HOW to achieve your goals rather than starting on a negative! At least you had the good sense to ask here!

POSITIVE MENTAL ATTITUDE (with a healthy does of skepticism and pessimism for balance!)



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]

However, to go back on my original point a bit...

When shooting for yourself, it's often a little self-limiting because you already had an idea on how the final piece would be cut. So when editors shoot, they tend to be too precise -- the stuff is almost guaranteed to cut perfectly, but you don't learn the most gritty parts of editing: Taking someone else's coverage and making it work in your own way.

So, it should be a double-barreled education. Since you don't have footage yet, shoot your own. But at some point, try to take on other people's films. Solving their problems, without having been privy to the conception process in the planning and shooting, will be the best editing education.


www.derekmok.com

I disagree bigtime with the self-limiting comment because when the Editor is on the shoot, the B-ROLL IS MUCH MORE INTERESTING!!! And the crew listens to your suggestions. They want to get it right the first time (a GOOD CREW does, anyway).

I am being asked to supervise many more shoots with my "Post Production eye". My studio asks me how they can make things easier for me rather than "fix it in post" on every shoot (which I whole-heartedly appreciate). I say let me go on the shoots & help set them up.

So we shot Tiger Woods and his coach Hank Haney on 2 separate greenscreen shoots in 2 separate studios. We had already had pre-pro meetings and I knew what I wanted the videos to look like (23 of them for in-game). I attended to make sure everything was framed correctly (talent placement / camera placement / greenscreen lit fully / etc). It's one thing when you come to work and someone hands you 7 greenscreen tapes already shot and says "GO". It's another thing when you were ON THE SHOOT, had a hand in setting up the talent and the shot. Made the Post process an absolute DREAM because it's all in your head like a hard drive. I love going on shoots.

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

There's a rarely mentioned point- stills. Lots of stuff starts from still pictures.

This became the film "12 Monkeys" many decades later.





One of the basic building blocks of a film usually isn't motion, but rather images and form.

Get a DVD of your favourite film and storyboard a scene. Pay attention to the film language, the choice of shots, study the placement of the objects, the distance of the camera from the subject, the camera movement, etc..



www.strypesinpost.com

To practice editing on copyrighted material is not copyright infringement. One can train, do mash-ups, directors cuts and remixes for personal use (and break Itunes encryption scheme while doing it). DMCA

> I disagree bigtime with the self-limiting comment because when the Editor is on the shoot, the
> B-ROLL IS MUCH MORE INTERESTING!!! And the crew listens to your suggestions.

You're talking about an editor contributing to the planning of a shoot. Never a bad thing.

I'm talking about earlier in the process. When the editor is the director. It takes experience to know to get a larger variety of shots, shots that cut together in a multitude of ways. Not to shoot only what you see edited in your head -- a common problem for all upstart filmmakers.


www.derekmok.com

> To practice editing on copyrighted material is not copyright infringement.

Actually, it is.

It's not the act of editing; it's the act of making the DVD contents into another medium that's the problem. Why do you think they make such a big fuss about a "digital copy" of the film on certain DVD releases?

Read the message at the front of DVDs: "Duplication...with or without monetary gain".
Any duplication is an infringement. Including those YouTube tribute videos.
Now, if you're not making profits or distributing the end results, they're less likely to slap penalties on you -- they'll probably just tell you to stop via an injunction. But strictly speaking, it's still infringement.


www.derekmok.com

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To practice editing on copyrighted material is not copyright infringement.

Wrong. If you COPY COPYRIGHTED MATERIAL, THAT'S ILLEGAL...period. Whether or not you cut it is irrelevant. It's the COPYING. A nasty lawyer can make your life hell for a "practice edit". We used feature films to score sound design to in school...but the school had permission from the studios to use those film scenes.

This is a big waste of time. You probably could have shot something and started editing already. If you are dead set on using someone's copyrighted materials, contact the owner of the intellectual property and ask permission. What do you have to lose?

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

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To practice editing on copyrighted material is not copyright infringement.

In this case, the law governing copyrights is secondary to the terms of use to which you agreed when you bought the movie from iTunes.

Joey oversimplifies quite a bit ? both the code itself (in §107) and the case law support numerous affirmative defenses ? but as far as a good rule of thumb goes, he's absolutely right: Don't ever, ever use anybody else's material unless you're willing to accept the inherent liability.

Remember, copyright infringement is, up to a point, a civil offense, not a crime. That means you can be sued for it regardless of whether one of the affirmative defenses applies. And when it's copyright-holder-with-a-lawyer-on-retainer-and-a-strong-motivation-to-defend-his-or-their-property versus some-guy-messing-around-at-home, the mere existence of a lawsuit means you've already lost. You've lost time and money spent dealing with it, even if you end up on the right side of the law.

Nobody needs that kind of hassle. Just don't use other people's property, and you'll know you're safe.

Katrin1980

I was in your shoes for a while. I know what you are trying to do. I totally understand as one of my 1st post here in the forum was a thread arguing usage.

Here is what i have learn 5 years later.

You need to edit mini dv 1st if you really want to build your skill (at least 20 or so fully completed projects). DV is considered not the best to work with visually and composite wise also.

>> So why should you work in it?

because....... you are gonna have to learn a lot of things to get to look good especially from a consumer cam. Your gonna have to test upresing techniques, color work, reversed fields, artifacts, keyframe and bit rates to get it looking good on dvd.

While shooting you will be using damn near every camera setting finding the one that look ok. Then your gonna buy a 1700 dollar prosumer cam (DV) and because of all you know about the crappy consumer cam that had you reading 35 web pages a day, the new cam will have you thinking, " well if it looks this good now why move up".

But in about 1.5+ years after that prosumer cam you will be in HD and have a very solid foundation when ever you edit the hd footage. Then you will be going into intermediate formats and begin to understand long gop, color space, composite prep, and FCP on its own will not look like the do all program anymore.

Notice how a lot of editors have gray hair even at early ages. Anyone editing for the last 4 years has been thru trying to get that darn mini dv footage to look good and work in many different delivery formats.

Mean while the guy that started with the 8core/ 32gig ram/ and a Kona3 / HPX500 and a 2500 dollar is thinking that the equipment is making it good. Then people start asking stuff like.... "why is it so red looking?" or why "does the text look so ruff?" or even why is it so jittery.

YOU NEED THAT PAIN OR YOU WILL HAVE A HARD CULTIVATING YOUR SKILL.

""" What you do with what you have, is more important than what you could do, with what you don't have."

> > > Knowledge + Action = Wisdom - J. Corbett 1992 """"

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Joey oversimplifies quite a bit

Huh?

Copyrighted material is protected from COPYING THE MATERIAL (hello?). Be it code or intellectual property. How is that oversimplifying Jeff?? Because I didn't quote statutes? IT'S WRONG and I think we can all agree on that.

Quote

You need to edit mini dv 1st if you really want to build your skill (at least 20 or so fully completed projects).

1. mini dv is not an edit format...it's a tape. Both DVCPRO-NTSC (SD) and HDV (HD) are recorded on mini dv so please don't be confused by that post.

2. You don't "need" to edit "mini dv" first. If you really want to build your skill IMHO, edit HD first. Most studios are changing over to HD and you will have a leg up on those still editing SD.

3. What format you start with really doesn't matter anyway. You need timing and the ability to make good choices to be a good editor. The tech stuff will come.

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

The oversimplification is just that not all not-explicitly-authorized acts of copying are copyright infringement. The statues and case law have identified a whole bunch of situations in which copying without permission ? under certain very specific and narrow circumstances ? is non-infringing.

I've come to despise the term "fair use" because its meaning has been corrupted by a generation of kids who grew up on Napster, but the bottom line is that copyright infringement is both a civil violation and a crime (depending on circumstances and degrees), but not all unauthorized copying is automatically copyright infringement.

Is this one of those cases? I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know, and the best a lawyer could do is say "probably" or "probably not." It'd be up to a judge to decide whether this specific act under discussion here would be infringing or not, and all I was saying is that it's better to avoid the question entirely.

But let's not lose sight of the larger point here: As long as there aren't any lawyers in the room who want to wax rhapsodic about the intricacies of Title 17 and its applications, I'm agreeing with you. It's far safer, pragmatically, not to use anybody else's property.

And as I said upwards a couple of times, the question never even comes up in this case, because the terms of use under which movies are sold by Apple through iTunes prohibit this kind of use. Those terms were agreed to explicitly when the movie was bought, so this kind of use is not okay, copyright or no copyright.

Quote

The oversimplification is just that not all not-explicitly-authorized acts of copying are copyright infringement.

OK...last words on this:

I never said that. I explicitly said COPYING COPYRIGHTED MATERIAL is COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT. Simple & clear.

If you are agreeing with me, it's in a backhanded-sort-'O-way.

When life gives you dilemmas...make dilemmanade.

Are you guys coming to NAB?

cus if so - we can get you a room



For instant answers to more than one hundred common FCP questions, check out the LAFCPUG FAQ Wiki here : [www.lafcpug.org]

oh gees, so many answers...gotta go to work, I'll answer later!

Now, I'm back... But let me say first that I really appreciate the discussion and that you guys are taking the time to give me tips. thanks

Now, it's not that I've never shot anything before...I have two bunnies, so I made two little movies about them. And this one time when our friend came over to Germany to scout locations (castles) I filmed the castles...inside and outside and made a movie out of it.
One and a half year ago I made a TV commercial for the tourism board of the Garda Lake. I didn't film it but I could work with the voice over talent which was really great. I decided which lines to record and where to edit them in...awesome.
In December I made a presentation for a company of ours about one of the products.
Then in January I almost worked the whole month to prepare for an event, a big birthday party for a CEO in Munich. The client wanted old racing car movies to run on the plasmas the whole night (30 hours of material I think) and I made a birthday movie for him...about his life and stuff.
I'm just writing all that so you don't get the wrong idea about me.

I'm cutting music videos and trailers cos it's what I want to do, I love it and it's basically how I taught myself FCP...just by reading books you only get so far. And I learned a lot by it: which shots to use and which not, what ankles fit best to each other, what to do when a clip is not as long as you need it to be, cutting to the beat, to create a lead story and so on...

I showed my samples and trailers to a good friend in L.A. who's been in the movie business for nearly 40 years (not an editor, he's FX supervisor) and he liked it a lot. He said my problem is not the 'storytelling' or the editing, it's the technical side of the editing process. He recommended to get an internship or to attend some classes.

But I agree with you guys that I should start working on my own little projects...animating Legos...like with stop-motion? that sounds fun I did three own projects now, so 17 more to go
As for filming in theaters or in acting classes...this is not L.A. If I offered to film someone with a mini DV they would probably laugh me off. Also, they're not many acting classes around and those at the academy they have their own ppl filming them...with better cameras.

So I had a talk with my boyfriend and we'll see to buying a better camera as soon as possible.

I'm looking at at that youtube link about "12 monkeys" now...impressive. thanks for posting that!

@J.Corbett: I never noticed the grey hair! but...I don't know many editors, here in Germany I know none at all. thank you for your comment...very honest.

I'll be in Vegas for the SuperMeet and the NAB. I hope I'll see some of you guys around. If you see a blonde girl with a German accent standing in some corner looking lost holding on to some diet coke...it's probably me.

Don't underestimate the value of shooting local sporting events. Professional venues will have rules regarding filming and stuff, but neighborhood or school games are likely to be open access. Spend a couple hours shooting, then assemble a ninety-second montage or something. Sports has a ton of movement, and the potential for editorial fun is great.

One of my favorite spots of all time has no dialogue and consists only of shots of movement. It must've been an editor's dream.

Jeff Harrell Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------->
> One of my favorite spots of all time has no
> dialogue and consists only of shots of movement.
> It must've been an editor's dream.
>
>




wow, amazing clip!
yeah, you might be right...I'll have a look.

Jeff that was a perfect example. Perfecto i tell ya. very nicely motivated shots.

Quote
Katrin
He said my problem is not the 'storytelling' or the editing, it's the technical side of the editing process.

yep, you are living my pass. I remember the same comment from several people. That technical part is how you will reach the skill level you need to. Just be patient with the process of learning those technical aspects. You need to run into some problems to get there.

Trust me by time you see 17 projects more you will run into some of those technical processes that will drive you COMPLETELY crazy. And those problems as they are solved will give you confidence and a slight swagger when they come up again.

Oh and don't underestimate working for schnitzel and cabage. You can get a lot of experience that way. Editing is not only finding how and where you want to cut. You also need to listen to a client tell you what they need and then translating that to the project.

I had a lot of open-ended projects where there was no instruction as to the style or content that the client needed. That was great till i ran into some editing request that i completely disagreed with. I had to release my preferred style to please the client ( who really didn't know what he was talking about-cube transitions throughout for every cut ).

Keep your passion but don't let it get in the way of building a good reputation.

I recommending the dvx100b for a really good pro sd picture and the HMC150 for excellent HD. Of course, i trust nothing but Panasonic and RED. BIAS

""" What you do with what you have, is more important than what you could do, with what you don't have."

> > > Knowledge + Action = Wisdom - J. Corbett 1992 """"